Good Miles article: Decline of African Americans in baseball

[Fro]

You can play basketball one on one... you need a ton of people to field proper baseball teams at a competitive level beyond messing around in the backyard as a elementary schooler.

 

I don't think it's as nearly as fun an individual sport to play for the average person as basketball, or even "throwing a football around". Have to wait to get up to bat, not involved in every play (especially in the outfield), etc, lots of dead time between pitches.

[frostwyrm]

its very demoralizing to fail in such a "personal" way....by striking out or dropping a ball.

 

That's one of my theories too. There is a lot of failure in baseball. Even the best batters will get put out 60% of the time. You need a lot of humility to learn baseball. All this egomaniacal hip-hop gangsta attitude that has been shoved down kids throats has made it a lot more difficult to whiff on a curveball and take it like a good sport. Humility has never been a strong point of hip-hop culture.

[J.R.]

Lots of unwarranted pessimism here.

 

The NBA has a hold on hip-hop culture, and it's the game of choice on the street; yet their attendance and ratings have been in a slump for years. Youth soccer has been huge for decades, yet the MLS' attendance and television exposure is pathetic.

 

Youth participation isn't all it's cracked up to be. Hide and seek is big among kids, but no one pays to see it. NASCAR is thriving, yet youth outlets for racing are virtually non-existant.

 

A day at the ballpark is an awesome time, the game of baseball can make for compelling television, and, while baseball traditionally seemed made for radio, it's also perfectly suited for the kind of fandom borne of the Internet. Those factors will keep baseball popular as a spectator sport.

 

I think the decline of black participation is unfortunate, but hip-hop won't be at the forefront of pop culture forever. The Latinos are getting ready to turn this country's zeitgeist upside down, and, fortunately for baseball, they seem to have a taste for the game that their predecessors in the "majority minority" game lack.

[KatJ]

Has anyone mentioned the risk of investment factor in baseball vs. football and basketball? I remember reading something about that issue in a different article on the same topic: dearth of black baseball players.

 

Baseball is a great game, but even if you go to college first, a player often gets to spend two years or more in the minors before sniffing an MLB callup. I think you can earn a decent living in AA and AAA (I really don't know - someone else can corroborate or deny that), but the travel and the lifestyle is far from jet set glamorous. It's buses and McDonalds and blasé to fleabag motels and hotels.

 

Compare that to the world of the NBA and NFL. A mega-talent kid gets drafted out of high school; a great player has his choice whether to enter the draft in college or finish school; and so on. Bottom line is that in four years or less (well, five - or even six - if you redshirt) you are in The Big Show, pulling down a cool million (give or take) - tons more if you get endorsement offers. That's got to be an offer you can't refuse if you're a young man, particulary an African-American male, particularly from a hardscrabble background.

 

Baseball can't compete with that at present. And I'm not sure that I want it to. I'm not a big fan of the bling in the NFL and NBA (for lack of a better term) social scene, and I especially don't care for how basketball has devolved into a sport for bruisers. I'd hate to see that happen to the MLB at large.

 

I think the only ways you could get an appreciable amount of blacks back to baseball, though, is to change the MLB image (and perhaps the game itself) to resemble the glossy NFL/NBA image, or somehow to figure out a way to curb materialism. Or, the third option (harder but with a bigger or better upside) effect change such that a Af-Am hardscrabble background is not a stereotype.

[KatJ]

its very demoralizing to fail in such a "personal" way....by striking out or dropping a ball.

 

That's one of my theories too. There is a lot of failure in baseball. Even the best batters will get put out 60% of the time. You need a lot of humility to learn baseball. All this egomaniacal hip-hop gangsta attitude that has been shoved down kids throats has made it a lot more difficult to whiff on a curveball and take it like a good sport. Humility has never been a strong point of hip-hop culture.

 

But I think there's a lot of failure in basketball also. 50% from the field as a team can be pretty good. About the only thing you can control success on as a basketball player is your free throws (unless you're Shaquille O'Neal).

[rawaction]

Has anyone mentioned the risk of investment factor in baseball vs. football and basketball? I remember reading something about that issue in a different article on the same topic: dearth of black baseball players.

 

Baseball is a great game, but even if you go to college first, a player often gets to spend two years or more in the minors before sniffing an MLB callup. I think you can earn a decent living in AA and AAA (I really don't know - someone else can corroborate or deny that), but the travel and the lifestyle is far from jet set glamorous. It's buses and McDonalds and blasé to fleabag motels and hotels.

 

Compare that to the world of the NBA and NFL. A mega-talent kid gets drafted out of high school; a great player has his choice whether to enter the draft in college or finish school; and so on. Bottom line is that in four years or less (well, five - or even six - if you redshirt) you are in The Big Show, pulling down a cool million (give or take) - tons more if you get endorsement offers. That's got to be an offer you can't refuse if you're a young man, particulary an African-American male, particularly from a hardscrabble background.

 

Baseball can't compete with that at present. And I'm not sure that I want it to. I'm not a big fan of the bling in the NFL and NBA (for lack of a better term) social scene, and I especially don't care for how basketball has devolved into a sport for bruisers. I'd hate to see that happen to the MLB at large.

 

I think the only ways you could get an appreciable amount of blacks back to baseball, though, is to change the MLB image (and perhaps the game itself) to resemble the glossy NFL/NBA image, or somehow to figure out a way to curb materialism. Or, the third option (harder but with a bigger or better upside) effect change such that a Af-Am hardscrabble background is not a stereotype.

 

That's completely unfair. Basically what I get from this is....black people don't play baseball because it's not as glamorous. That's completely untrue.

 

First, baseball is the easiest sport to break into professionally because of the minor leagues. Secondly, baseball pays the highest salary, so there is more opportunity to get that "bling" as you call it. Baseball is less physically demanding than football. It's much less based on God given genetics (height, jumping ability, athletic ability) than basketball.

[Wilson A2000]

I wonder if this issue has anythign to do with the idea that in baseball you have to put your dues in before you get to the bigs. Many baseball players go to college first, graduate, then go to the minors, and then the bigs. It's hard to get money quickly. Also, it is hard to get a game of baseball going. Yes you can always throw a ball around, but it is easier and cheaper to play basketball. There are more courts available for basketball too.

[Omar]

I dont get it. According to Dusty, dark skinned players play better in the heat.

[rawaction]

I wonder if this issue has anythign to do with the idea that in baseball you have to put your dues in before you get to the bigs. Many baseball players go to college first, graduate, then go to the minors, and then the bigs. It's hard to get money quickly. Also, it is hard to get a game of baseball going. Yes you can always throw a ball around, but it is easier and cheaper to play basketball. There are more courts available for basketball too.

 

Probably a little, but still there are 300 more MLB roster spots than there are NBA roster spots. If you don't make it in the NBA, you are the equivalent of a minor leaguer in baseball. The pay is actually worse, if I'm not mistaken. And I would probably say that more baseball players actually come right out of HS. Ones that graduate from college usually aren't talented enough to make big money in the majors. And that still doesn't help the argument against football, where kids have to stay in college for 3 years and get physically abused while doing so.

[UK1679666180]

For the most part, it's not their 1st choice. In urban sectors, space is at minimum, people are at a maximum, and equipment is much more difficult to obtain.

 

Even in rural areas, I have to drive a couple of miles to get to a baseball field. Find one with a fence and it's another 25 miles.

 

Baseball is not an easily accessible sport, factor in financial costs to play properly as well as the right amount of people and it's easy to understand why it is a concern.

 

But whites don't play as often as they used to either, it really isn't a race issue to me, but a baseball issue.

[KatJ]

Has anyone mentioned the risk of investment factor in baseball vs. football and basketball? I remember reading something about that issue in a different article on the same topic: dearth of black baseball players.

 

Baseball is a great game, but even if you go to college first, a player often gets to spend two years or more in the minors before sniffing an MLB callup. I think you can earn a decent living in AA and AAA (I really don't know - someone else can corroborate or deny that), but the travel and the lifestyle is far from jet set glamorous. It's buses and McDonalds and blasé to fleabag motels and hotels.

 

Compare that to the world of the NBA and NFL. A mega-talent kid gets drafted out of high school; a great player has his choice whether to enter the draft in college or finish school; and so on. Bottom line is that in four years or less (well, five - or even six - if you redshirt) you are in The Big Show, pulling down a cool million (give or take) - tons more if you get endorsement offers. That's got to be an offer you can't refuse if you're a young man, particulary an African-American male, particularly from a hardscrabble background.

 

Baseball can't compete with that at present. And I'm not sure that I want it to. I'm not a big fan of the bling in the NFL and NBA (for lack of a better term) social scene, and I especially don't care for how basketball has devolved into a sport for bruisers. I'd hate to see that happen to the MLB at large.

 

I think the only ways you could get an appreciable amount of blacks back to baseball, though, is to change the MLB image (and perhaps the game itself) to resemble the glossy NFL/NBA image, or somehow to figure out a way to curb materialism. Or, the third option (harder but with a bigger or better upside) effect change such that a Af-Am hardscrabble background is not a stereotype.

 

That's completely unfair. Basically what I get from this is....black people don't play baseball because it's not as glamorous. That's completely untrue.

 

First, baseball is the easiest sport to break into professionally because of the minor leagues. Secondly, baseball pays the highest salary, so there is more opportunity to get that "bling" as you call it. Baseball is less physically demanding than football. It's much less based on God given genetics (height, jumping ability, athletic ability) than basketball.

 

Sorry for the misunderstanding - my intent was to focus on the "instant gratification" of NBA/NFL vs. paying your dues through the minor leagues in MLB.

[goonys evil twin]

Basically what I get from this is....black people don't play baseball because it's not as glamorous. That's completely untrue.

 

 

I think it's true for some, maybe many. I think some black youth, as well as white youth, see the culture surrounding basketball and, to an extent football, as much more glamorous (although that might not be the right word) than the culture of baseball. Basketball stars are much bigger celebrities than baseball stars. And baseball is a much more humbling game. Football stars have a greater tough guy aura, while baseball players just aren't thought of as elite athletes.

 

If you wanted to do it just for money, baseball is probably your best bet. But if you're 14, thinking over your options, the lure of the college basketball star, or college football star, or straight to the NBA star is far greater than the minor league baseball player or college baseball player. There's a very limited cool factor for those last two.

[frostwyrm]

Basically what I get from this is....black people don't play baseball because it's not as glamorous. That's completely untrue.

 

 

I think it's true for some, maybe many. I think some black youth, as well as white youth, see the culture surrounding basketball and, to an extent football, as much more glamorous (although that might not be the right word) than the culture of baseball. Basketball stars are much bigger celebrities than baseball stars. And baseball is a much more humbling game. Football stars have a greater tough guy aura, while baseball players just aren't thought of as elite athletes.

 

If you wanted to do it just for money, baseball is probably your best bet. But if you're 14, thinking over your options, the lure of the college basketball star, or college football star, or straight to the NBA star is far greater than the minor league baseball player or college baseball player. There's a very limited cool factor for those last two.

 

I agree, glamor matters enormously. Sports is entertainment and pop culture. Since when could you discuss a piece of American entertainment or pop culture without considering its glamor quotient?

[soapy]

Basically what I get from this is....black people don't play baseball because it's not as glamorous. That's completely untrue.

 

 

I think it's true for some, maybe many. I think some black youth, as well as white youth, see the culture surrounding basketball and, to an extent football, as much more glamorous (although that might not be the right word) than the culture of baseball. Basketball stars are much bigger celebrities than baseball stars. And baseball is a much more humbling game. Football stars have a greater tough guy aura, while baseball players just aren't thought of as elite athletes.

 

If you wanted to do it just for money, baseball is probably your best bet. But if you're 14, thinking over your options, the lure of the college basketball star, or college football star, or straight to the NBA star is far greater than the minor league baseball player or college baseball player. There's a very limited cool factor for those last two.

 

I think you've hit on another important area here aside from the MLB v. NFL/NBA. Even in the college (probably even highschool) ranks football and basketball players get much more attention or "glamour" or whatever you want to call it. How many college baseball stars can the typical baseball fan run out off the top of one's head? Whereas with college football and basketball, the stars are very well known around the country.

 

Having said that, this logic would apply to athletes of any race, not only African American youth.

[rawaction]

Basically what I get from this is....black people don't play baseball because it's not as glamorous. That's completely untrue.

 

 

I think it's true for some, maybe many. I think some black youth, as well as white youth, see the culture surrounding basketball and, to an extent football, as much more glamorous (although that might not be the right word) than the culture of baseball. Basketball stars are much bigger celebrities than baseball stars. And baseball is a much more humbling game. Football stars have a greater tough guy aura, while baseball players just aren't thought of as elite athletes.

 

If you wanted to do it just for money, baseball is probably your best bet. But if you're 14, thinking over your options, the lure of the college basketball star, or college football star, or straight to the NBA star is far greater than the minor league baseball player or college baseball player. There's a very limited cool factor for those last two.

 

I think you've hit on another important area here aside from the MLB v. NFL/NBA. Even in the college (probably even highschool) ranks football and basketball players get much more attention or "glamour" or whatever you want to call it. How many college baseball stars can the typical baseball fan run out off the top of one's head? Whereas with college football and basketball, the stars are very well known around the country.

 

Having said that, this logic would apply to athletes of any race, not only African American youth.

 

Ok. I guess I see your points. Groupie love is much better from basketball and football at the amateur level. But again, I think it's that way because baseball is considered a boring game.

[goonys evil twin]

Ok. I guess I see your points. Groupie love is much better from basketball and football at the amateur level. But again, I think it's that way because baseball is considered a boring game.

 

Well, yeah, it's all intertwined. There is no one reason for the decline in play by any group.