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LOL, WTF? http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl/player_search.cgi?search=2003+cubs http://www.baseball-reference.com/player_search.cgi?sourceid=Mozilla-search&search=2007+cubs You done embarrassing yourself yet? Dude, what is your deal? Do you not understand how numbers work? Oh now I see what you're doing. You're look at the pyth record. Nice Manager: Dusty Baker (88-74) Manager: Lou Piniella (85-77) It would probably be best if you just left now.

Again, try and keep up. Dear god. You must be joking. I was talking about the 2007 division. THE 2003 CUBS WON 88 GAMES, NOT 85. NOBODY BROUGHT UP THE 2003 CUBS. WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THE 2007 CUBS. Just admit you were wrong and move on. You're making yourself look worse now by trying to wiggle out of it.

And who built the 67 win team? He turned them into an 85 win team by buying everything, again going back the payroll thing. That 85 win season also came at the cost of giving Soriano 136 million dollars. So let's see. He built a horrible 67 win team, then was given a ton of cash to make it better, spent all that cash, then won an okay 85 wins in a horrible division, and we're supposed to congratulate him for that? Wow. Such low standards. What on earth are you talking about? The 2003 Cubs won 85 games. We're talking about the 2003 team here. Please, if you're going to participate in the discussion... know what the discussion is about. Umm, apparently you're the one who needs to pay attention. The 2003 Cubs won 88 games, not 85. The 85 win team is obviously the 07 team. Maybe you should make sure you know what you're talking about before saying things. Jesus Christ... YOU are the one who first brought up the 85 win team... which was the 2003 team. For the love of God, please try and keep up. Dude are you joking? THE 2003 CUBS WON 88 GAMES. THE 85 WIN TEAM WAS IN 2007. Jesus.

And who built the 67 win team? He turned them into an 85 win team by buying everything, again going back the payroll thing. That 85 win season also came at the cost of giving Soriano 136 million dollars. So let's see. He built a horrible 67 win team, then was given a ton of cash to make it better, spent all that cash, then won an okay 85 wins in a horrible division, and we're supposed to congratulate him for that? Wow. Such low standards. What on earth are you talking about? The 2003 Cubs won 85 games. We're talking about the 2003 team here. Please, if you're going to participate in the discussion... know what the discussion is about. And, of course, you don't know who built the 2002 Cubs. No surprise. It wasn't Hendry, though. I'd tell you to look it up yourself, but for some reason I don't think you'd have success. Hendry took over as GM midway thru the '02 season. The 2003 Cubs won 88 games. Please, if you're going to participate in the discussion... know what the discussion is about. I'm the one who brought up the 85 win team. I was and still am talking about the extremely mediocre 2007 Cubs, for which Hendry should receive very little credit, if any. now he'll just ignore it because of how stupid he's made himself look

And who built the 67 win team? He turned them into an 85 win team by buying everything, again going back the payroll thing. That 85 win season also came at the cost of giving Soriano 136 million dollars. So let's see. He built a horrible 67 win team, then was given a ton of cash to make it better, spent all that cash, then won an okay 85 wins in a horrible division, and we're supposed to congratulate him for that? Wow. Such low standards. What on earth are you talking about? The 2003 Cubs won 85 games. We're talking about the 2003 team here. Please, if you're going to participate in the discussion... know what the discussion is about. Umm, apparently you're the one who needs to pay attention. The 2003 Cubs won 88 games, not 85. The 85 win team is obviously the 07 team. Maybe you should make sure you know what you're talking about before saying things.

He took a 67 win team that was embarrassingly bad and turned them into a division winner the following year -- again, his job. Yes, neat indeed. I wonder who assembled that 67 win team. Hendry's breathing oxygen a good man could be using. He's a waste. Always has been. Christ, does anyone in this thread know what the hell is going on? Hendry didn't assemble that team! Umm, he didn't? Then who did? Hendry has been the GM since 2002. And they won 66 games in 06, not 67.

It should only be expected from people who don't really know anything about stats. What a dumb statement. I'm not some idiot that thinks RBI's and Runs scored are the important stats. Don't respond to my posts assuming so. What I, very clearly, stated, was that while other stats certainly mean a whole lot more when evaluating a player... when discussing player A, the former Cub was traded to make room for player B, their run producing stats are absolutely fair game for conversation. Ugh. No they're not. They play in completely different lineups. You just don't get it. RBIs are a worthless stat to look at when determing whop has been a better hitter. RBIs are as much about luck and lineup positiomning as they are about actually performance. Nobody is saying the RBIs themselves don't matter. But to use them to compare playuers is dumb, yeah. You should be using rate stats and stuff like that. Thing that a player... you know.... actually controls. I'll say this again. James Loney has 49 RBI's and has a .732 OPS. Do you understand that Loney has more RBIs than many many players who have been much better than him this season?

And who built the 67 win team? He turned them into an 85 win team by buying everything, again going back the payroll thing. That 85 win season also came at the cost of giving Soriano 136 million dollars. So let's see. He built a horrible 67 win team, then was given a ton of cash to make it better, spent all that cash, then won an okay 85 wins in a horrible division, and we're supposed to congratulate him for that? Wow. Such low standards.

Umm, what? You're saying that having a higher payroll doesn't make it easier to build a team with more wins?

Not really. They have nice ERA's, but they've all been walk machines. Gaub has walked 19 in 30.1 IP. Stevens has walked 19 in 35.2 IP. Archer has walked 36 in 53.1 IP. Those are some really ugly totals. It's hard to get excited about that. DeRosa didn't get 30 million dollars.

never said it was

Give credit for him signing Derosa? Well, perhaps if he were: A: Still a Cub B: Wasn't traded for marginal prospects C: Not playing for the Cardinals DeRosa is not a good example. When DeRosa was signed he was considered a risk considering he really never played everyday for a full year. DeRosa went on to have a pretty decent season and then a career year for the Cubs and played a big role in both divison titles. They sold high on a 34 year old Middle Infielder, something you rarley can do. DeRosa OPS'd .857 last year. There was no way he was going to do that again. DeRosa also got helped out by leading the league in "lucky" home runs last year with 8. Look DeRosa is a good player, however he is not a superstar. He is below avg. defensivly basically everywhere you up put him. The biggest reason why the Cubs are struggling this year IMO is your bullpen and the loss of A-Ram. To blame this all on Hendry just seems like a scape goat. The fact is they have a bunch of players underachiving... Soriano, Bradley, Marmol, Harden, Gregg and Soto just to name a few. And then take out the Cubs best player (Aramis) and you end up being 2 games under .500. But lucky for the Cubs (and brewers) its the NL Central. You still have a really good starting rotation. And for how bad and under achving the cubs have been they are still only 3.5 games back. please explain to me what a lucky home run is, it sounds so moronic that maybe im just to smart to understand It's not really hard to figure out what it means. Bill James keeps a stat like that, but I'm not sure if that's the one he's talking about. Lucky home runs = wind aided home runs, home runs to small parts of parks, etc. A lot of DeRo's home runs last year were either wind helped or just barely got into the basket. That's what he's talking about. It's kind of pointless to talk about that though since he's hitting even more home runs this season.

We can't blame him for the Cubs not performing in the playoffs. That's not what he's saying. He's saying it's silly to congratulate Hendyr for winning the division in 07, when really it was only because the Cubs played in an awful division. Jim built a roster that beat the competition and won the division -- that's his job. No, he built an 85 win team. He got into the playoffs because the other teams sucked. If the Brewers win 87 games that year and win the division, did Hendry still do a good job? He won 85 games in a horrible division with a big payroll. Neat.

Remember when Hednry said in the offseason that Dempster was a key clubhouse guy and they had to re-sign him beause of that? Good times.

We can't blame him for the Cubs not performing in the playoffs. That's not what he's saying. He's saying it's silly to congratulate Hendyr for winning the division in 07, when really it was only because the Cubs played in an awful division.

It should only be expected from people who don't really know anything about stats. Comparing RBIs is useless in every situation. RBI's are a result of lineup position, lineup talent, luck, and rate stats. He was brought here to hit. Look at stats that show how he's done that. James Loney has a .732 OPS and has 49 RBIs.

Because it's hard to find many good things he's done

Once again, Hendry has little to do with the drafting since he's become the GM. And he didn't get just "marginal prospects" for DeRosa. Then what would you call Gaub, Archer, and Stevens? They are the very definition of marginal prospects.

good

Umm, many people questioned how well he would hit. Nobody thought he would be this bad, but there was def concern over how good he was, considering he's been like an .830 guy most of his career.

Not really. At least they got a major league reliever, and Perez is a pretty good prospect. We got 3 mediocre prospects who can't throw strikes. I'd take Perez..... plus they said the PTBNL is a significant factor in the deal.

Ugh. No, he didn't. "Sold high" implies that you got max value for the guy. Hendry oculdn't even get a major league reliever for DeRosa. He did not sell high. The Indians just got a better package for him than the Cubs got. I don't even know what to say to that. What good has he done? The only reason we won the division in 07 was because of the terrible division. The 08 team was the only one that was anything special, and he quickly erased that by having an awful, awful offseason after it. Hendry has been given a massive payroll every year, and we're congratulating him because he led us to the playoffs a couple times? Forget the fact that he has killed the organization with bad contracts. Look at the outfield. Soriano has 5 years left after this season in left. Bradley has 2+. Fukudome has 2+. And guess what? All 3 of them have horrible, unmovable contracts. But hey, Soriano helped up win the division a couple times, right! That makes it okay that he has a ridiculously awful contract that is going to hurt the team for another half decade still. We can't upgrade anywhere because most of the poisition are locked in with bad contracts that can't be moved, and we don't have money to spend anyways because he wasted it all on mediocre talent. I can't even begin to fathom the idea of saying that Hendry's good moves have outweighed his negative ones. Before this offseason you may have been able to make that argument. Now it's just ridiculous.

who cares, we'll still suck even if we make the type of move we're capable of (aka only a small one)

it's uzr

it's both. really it wouldn't matter howl ou uses it. the pitchers just arent good.