David

I talked to the Syracuse Chiefs trainer and he said that a lot of the players don't work hard or see the value of keeping in shape until they get hurt. They have this "I'm indestructible" feeling and just think they are every going to need to do the things they need to do to stay healthy and prolong their careers and for many it's too late when they finally realize this. So you are saying there is wisdom in old age?? could be, or his wife said "Kerry, you are starting to look like John Kruk." I know that would do it for me. Or maybe she said, "Kerry if you don't lose some weight, you're not going to be able to get your fat arse out of this hot tub." If Sarah is in there too, is that really such a bad thing?

Maybe I should clarify. I don't really mean a hitter should go up to the plate with his bat on his shoulder all the time. I was just trying to refer to a general approach at the plate that I'd like to see. You still need to mix it up. Forgive the poker analogy, but even if you're a tight player and only wait for premium hands to play, every once in a while you have to mix it up and throw some chips in with a hand you wouldn't normally play. A lot of times it pays off big when a conservative player makes a surprise aggressive move. You can't get predictable.

And before last year, were either Encarnacion or Duncan thought of as #2 hitters? If I recall correctly, Encarnacion was penciled in as a 5-6-7 guy (depending on who was sitting), and Duncan was more of a 5-6-7 guy as well. Put ANYBODY in front of Pujols, and I promise you they will hit better. I don't see what your argument is. IMB just showed you that Encarnacion sucked even more than usual in the 2-hole (with Pujols "protecting" him), not that lineup splits usually provide much of a significant sample size anyway.

You should never base major personell and lineup decisions on spring training performance (this is true of pitchers, especially, but position players too). There are too many variables, and it's not usually a very significant sample size to base anything on. I wish there were less of this competing for a job in ST crap in MLB circles, but, at least, spring performance usually isn't used to determine much aside from a 5th starter, 12th pitcher, or last guy off the bench. I'd say the loads of information you have on a player before a spring game is even played are far more valuable in terms of coming to a conclusion than anything you can get out of 30 spring training games. Besides, Murton isn't just a case of a guy with potential. He has shown he can do it. His floor is there. He doesn't need to prove he belongs at the Major League level, he just needs to continue to progress and have a chance to reach his ceiling.

Yeah but it's much more fun IMO to be optimistic from the beginning then to jump on board once they start winning! I agree...so long as they KEEP winning. I may have trouble holding on to my pessimism until opening day. Come on and take the leap....I know it's scary but what the heck it's always an interesting ride! I took the leap last year, and my Cardinal buddy in the cubicle next to me never let me hear the end of it...I have to be at least a LITTLE more cautious this year. Let me guess, after we took all those games from the Cards early and before we lost Lee, right? I was there too, man.

not really relevant to this conversation, but I do imagine Cubs hitters walking a LOT more this year with the new hitting coach and with Dusty being gone. I think just getting the opposing pitchers to throw more pitches is the key and walks are just a byproduct of that. I'd put it the opposite. Well, not exactly. IMO, walks and getting the pitchers to throw more pitches are a byproduct of waiting for a pitch you can hit hard somewhere. Making contact with anything in the strike zone just for the sake of making contact (outside of some situations, obviously, like a close two strike pitch) is the one thing they need to stay totally away from. Even on two strikes, if there's a runner on first and less than two outs, I'd almost rather they take strike three than to just try and make contact for the sake of contact, because a good amount of the time that swing, on a pitcher's pitch, is going to result in two outs instead of one. Sorry, got off on a bit of a tangent there. If they go up there with the approach that before two strikes (in most cases), they're only going to swing if they get a pitch to hit, I think the rest will come. I just hope to see a lot less swinging early in the count this year. We've been letting the opposing pitcher off the hook way too easily, especially since 2003.

With the talk of DeRosa/Theriot playing the outfield lately, I'm holding out hope that Lou will do the right thing and basically straight-platoon Jones and Theriot. That would probably make for a pretty productive combo. Whether Theriot plays 2B and DeRosa plays RF or Theriot just plays RF in that scenario doesn't much matter to me.

Overreact much? AFAIK, they haven't even played a Cactus League game yet.

I just hope his fastball is back in the mid-90's. That would be a great sign.

Is it really "stupid" when Floyd is two years removed from a near MVP-like season? Well, I guess they could still trot out Soriano, Murton, and Floyd until Floyd breaks a fingernail. "near MVP-like?" Even that is a bit of a stretch. He hit .273/.358/.505 Pretty solid, not bad at all, but nowhere near MVP like. In fact, if that's anywhere near MVP-like, then Jacque Jones' 2006 wasn't too far off either. And yes, it's dumb, because Murton is young and has a lot of potential as a hitter and has already realized a good enough deal of it for us to be able to believe he is the real thing. He's patient (exactly what this team needs), and has shown signs of developing power. Floyd was brought here to be the 4th OF, if he's anything more than that at Murton's expense, it would be a mistake.

Yes, you are EDIT - IIRC, it's Scott Moore.

Yeah, Izturis hasn't showed up yet. He's probably got achey bones like I do. . We can only hope.

I tend to think that a lot of writers are just lazy, don't really follow the game as closely as they should, and just assume that the "young" guy who pitched in AAA last year will have to compete for a rotation spot. I'm pretty confident that Hill's role on this team is more or less secure. I don't care what a couple of morons writing for the local papers/Cubs website imagine to be the case. And if they have something concrete, they should say so.

If he plays gold glove caliber defense and hits about .280+ in the 8 hole, I think his health is definitely important. If Cesar Izturis hits over .280 I'll buy everyone here a Coke. Because the odds are signifigantly stacked against him. As was noted, his career OBP is .295. He's only OBP's over .300 twice, and one of those was a hearty .302. He's terrible, and he'd help the team more on the DL than he would in the batting order. I'll buy everyone a Pepsi if he does, too.

If he plays gold glove caliber defense and hits about .280+ in the 8 hole, I think his health is definitely important. His defense could be the best ever, and it wouldn't matter. He's that bad with the bat. I would've ripped all my hair out if I were a Mets fan in the mid to late 90's.

Had you taken the time to read MY posts, you would see that I never said that. I've only said that I am not going to get all worried about the possibility forwarded by some uninformed writer that Hill won't be in the rotation until some quote or action by the Cubs organization itself leads me to believe that will be the case. Unfounded? I've read nothing that says that Hill will be in the rotation for the Chicago Cubs. All I've read is that he will be competing for a job. It speaks volumes about Jim Hendry and the Cubs. Volumes. Hill has been the best pitching propspect in the Cubs organization for going on three years now. Instead he's been brought up, used sparingly, demoted to the bullpen, sent down, brought up, used sparingly, sent down, brought up, in trouble with Dusty and Larry, sent down, and brought up again. In my opinion Marquis is supposed to be an insurance policy on Prior. Instad it seems as if he has an inside track in the rotation. Z Lilly Marquis Prior That leaves Miller, Guzman, and Hill fighting it out for the last spot, when perhaps all three of them will be better than Marquis. And yet, you've yet to read any quotes from anyone associated with the Chicago Cubs (AFAIK) to suggest such a thing. You only get conjecture from several beat writers whom we have had no problem deeming clueless several times in the past.

I'm not so sure of that. Didn't Grudz get a vote or two for the NL MVP that year? If he did, the voter was on drugs.

I have to disagree. Prior healthy and pitching well (by his stardards) is the best starter on this team. I think he meant Hill was the third best starter on the team in that case. Yea, I was trying to make the point that Hill's one of our top 3 in any event. Sorry. My bad. Too much arguing in this thread. :) I agree that Prior, Z, and Hill would make up the top 3.

I'm not so sure of that.

well, then i don't think we have anything else to discuss. you're right, he'll never amount to anything. oh wait, he was one of the best pitchers in baseball post-ASB in '06. guess judging a guy based on a few scattered innings may not be the best way to go. The king of hyperbole speaks again. so you weren't just judging hill on a few scattered innings? No. I'm saying that you can't say that he should have been up more than he was when he put up a 9.31 ERA in four starts in May. Something had to change, so he went down and worked on some things that helped him out. He is quoted as saying such. I know you are a big fan of his. So am I. But, I don't see the reason for all of this clamoring that he has been so mistreated by this organization. He still had to demonstrate that he could perform at the major league level. He didn't do that in May. Exactly. Like it or not, the Cubs were trying to salvage the season which was pretty much lost without DLee at that point. They were calling people up and sending them down left and right, IIRC. It's hard to use the Major Leagues to develop players and let them work out the kinks as early as May, on a team with a $90+ million payroll playing in a major market. In hindsight, it definitely would've made more sense to let Hill work out the kinks with the big club, but the Cubs were trying desperately to salvage the season, or at least tread water until Lee (and Wood and Prior) came back. Hill was struggling badly and he got sent back down.

I have to disagree. Prior healthy and pitching well (by his stardards) is the best starter on this team.

QFT

This is insanity, guys. Stop flipping out over the speculation of a few local sportswriters who have earned zero credibility over the years. Hill will be in the rotation, barring injury or a flat out terrible spring, for the Chicago Cubs this season. I don't doubt it for one second. I'll go even further. There is no way that Wade Miller is going to go out and impress everyone into giving him a rotation spot. He's done. He hasn't even been a very good pitcher in what, 5 years? At best, he'll have a solid spring and take a long relief spot. This is my opinion. Obviously, you don't have to take it as fact. But it's worth just as much as the opinions of these hack writers.

10 pitches? Well...It's a start. Old news...check this thread, around 2 PM yesterday. Damn you, noob!

If this happens, I will be a bit upset. Intentionally excluding arguably the best bullpen arm we've got (Wuertz) is just stupid. I think this isn't all that arguable now that Wood is in the bullpen. ;) But I agree about Wuertz. Just being a smart ass.