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Regarding Marmol, you try to win the game you are playing and worry about the future after the game. We have some guys in minors who could have came up and made a spot start if Marquis had been needed last night. Also, this goes back to the whole Marshall thing. Had Lou let him face more than 1 guy, he could have pushed everybody back in the bullpen, but no for some reason Marshall is only allowed to face a lefty. Same goes for the Cedeno/Fontenot thing, it was a product of Lous bad decision making that made this a neccessity. I might agree with you on the general point about Marmol, although when I think about the specific game last night I still think I have more faith in Fox/Marmol than Marmol/Marquis. As average as Marquis is as a starter, he has proven to be really bad out of the pen during his career. As for Marshall, the question remains. Do you leave Lieber in to try to get out of the inning? Do you double-switch when Marshall comes into the game? (which isn't the best part of the batting order for it. The Cubs had just finished with the 5 spot in the order, so there really isn't anybody to double-switch unless you are willing to take Fukudome out in order for Marshall to pitch an extra inning, which I'm not). Those are the only two ways that Marshall could have avoided only pitching to 1 batter, because you had to pinch-hit for him with a runner on. That early in the game I dont think pinch hitting for him would be neccessary. It was the 7th inning with the Cubs down by a run. I don't think you can be throwing away chances to score when you're down that late in the game.

I also thought Kerry Wood should have hit for himself and gone out there again in the tenth. Double-switching Henry in there for him was really not smart. Wood had thrown few pitches and looked great out there. And Marshall's usage this year is beyond stupid. So frustrating. That's probably what surprised me most about last night. I know they're being careful with Wood, but that's really careful. In some ways I appreciated that they're doing all they can to save his arm, but I really think he should be able to throw 20+ pitches on back to back days. Wood didn't even need to hit for himself to pitch a 2nd inning. His spot didn't come up until the 11th.

Regarding Marmol, you try to win the game you are playing and worry about the future after the game. We have some guys in minors who could have came up and made a spot start if Marquis had been needed last night. Also, this goes back to the whole Marshall thing. Had Lou let him face more than 1 guy, he could have pushed everybody back in the bullpen, but no for some reason Marshall is only allowed to face a lefty. Same goes for the Cedeno/Fontenot thing, it was a product of Lous bad decision making that made this a neccessity. I might agree with you on the general point about Marmol, although when I think about the specific game last night I still think I have more faith in Fox/Marmol than Marmol/Marquis. As average as Marquis is as a starter, he has proven to be really bad out of the pen during his career. As for Marshall, the question remains. Do you leave Lieber in to try to get out of the inning? Do you double-switch when Marshall comes into the game? (which isn't the best part of the batting order for it. The Cubs had just finished with the 5 spot in the order, so there really isn't anybody to double-switch unless you are willing to take Fukudome out in order for Marshall to pitch an extra inning, which I'm not). Those are the only two ways that Marshall could have avoided only pitching to 1 batter, because you had to pinch-hit for him with a runner on.

BTW, their FIP numbers so far this year: Zambrano: 3.31 Dempster: 4.34 Marquis: 4.54 Lilly: 4.63 Hill: 5.89

Hill-agreed, although Hill would have struggled with his control any day you threw him, the coaching staff didn't do him any favors. So his problems last night weren't all on the coaching staff, but they definitely share the blame. Marshall-agreed, although what do you do? Do you let Lieber try to finish the inning there? 4 out of the 5 previous balls hit off Lieber were hit decently hard. It was about time for him to go, and then Marshall's spot came up that next inning. As far as Cedeno and Fontenot, Fontenot came into the game to save the bullpen. Lou decided Howry needed to go 2 innings, and he could have only gone 1 if they had left Cedeno in the game because Cedeno was locked into the 9 spot, while Fontenot could go into the 4 spot. I agree with Lou on this one. They needed Howry at that point to go 2 innings with what they had left behind him in the bullpen. I would have agreed with it even if it didn't work, but it did. Howry pitched 2 strong innings, and Fontenot got on base twice in 3 tries last night. If you bring in Marmol, you're just creating a worse situation down the road. They didn't want to use Marmol for more than one inning last night, so if you bring in Marmol to relieve Fox and he gets out of the 11th, now you have to use Marquis in the 12th and mess up your rotation. Leaving Fox in was the only course of action at that point. As far as Sori in LF, you had to see during the drills and fielding practice that his range was really poor right now. That was a really bad decision by Lou to leave him in there on Thursday.

Agreed. If you're going to put blame on the Cubs, they deserve it for trying to change his delivery slightly to make him quicker to home plate. It's silly to do that for any effective pitcher, and it's really silly to do that for a player like Hill. They basically washed away any confidence he had in his old delivery, and it's hard to return to it now after trying to practice the new one. Hill was always wild in big part because he had good stuff, and it's sometimes hard to locate it. Now he's wild IMO because his body isn't throwing consistently the same way. Each pitch is an adventure because he has no confidence in any delivery right now, and so he combines a bunch of different elements from different methods, which doesn't work. Note: In no way am I calling Rich Hill soft in this previous paragraph. It's human nature that when you try to change something that you have done for years, your body still wants to repeat what it has consistently done. Then if you don't have initial success with the new method, you start to wonder, and even if you're continuing to try the new method parts of the old method sneak in, which makes things even worse. It happens a lot to professional golfers who try to overhaul their swing. They need to completely forget about the new delivery, have him watch some video of the old delivery, and then send him down to the minors and just tell him to focus on repeating his mechanics and that performance doesn't matter, that he'll stay in pretty much no matter what until his pitch count is reached. Do that, and a couple of weeks from now I think Hill would be ready to go.

The way Lou handled Marquis at times last year, if Marquis had been walking guys at a pretty high rate for a couple weeks and had walked 4 guys in the first inning, Lou probably would have pulled him. I would agree with you that Lilly probably gets the chance to work out of it.

The bullpen will do very little for Hill or the Cubs. He would just be a wasted spot at the back of the pen, because the Cubs couldn't afford to bring him into any close game never knowing how his control will be. For Hill, he needs innings in order to find the mechanics he had last year and get practice at repeating them so that he can quickly return to form. If Hill is not going to get that in the Chicago rotation, he needs to be in the Iowa rotation.

With this quote, I would say it's a definite that Hill is gone: First off, Piniella is part of the problem for there being no bullpen because of his short leash on Hill the last 3 games. At the same time, they need to do whatever they can to get his mechanics straight, because with his current control he'll continue to need an abnormal number of balls in play to be caught in order to be effective, and this is not a situation where Rich can just flip a switch and have control again. What's very interesting is that Cubs.com said that Piniella hinted that it would be Marshall replacing Hill, with Eyre moving into Marshall's spot. I'd really like to know how they're going to stretch Marshall out quickly.

no, he hasn't. i don't think there's any doubt that he's out of the rotation...90% sure of that. and i'd say there's a very good chance he goes to AAA. he should have been left in for at least one more batter tonight. that's four starts in a row that lou has had a remarkably short leash on hill. it's as if it's 2005 and hill has never had success before. One more batter and the game might have been over in the first inning. the worst that would have happened is another walk and one more run. as it is, they lost anyway, ruined the bullpen in the process, and likely completely demoralized hill. leaving him for at least one more batter would have been the right thing to do. I would tend to agree with that. At least let him start the next batter. If he gets to 2-0, maybe you pull him. But the next batter was Izturis, and he cannot hurt you that badly, and also has been known to swing early in some situations. So maybe you get a lucky ground ball on a pitch just off the corner and get out of the inning. I still doubt Hill would make it more than into getting into the 4th tonight, but even those couple of innings might have made a big difference for his confidence level and for how much the bullpen was used.

Lilly vs. Lohse. The Cubs players have absolutely pounded Lohse during his career. Hopefully they can continue that tomorrow and even up the series.

This is as good of thread as any. Kobe Bryant has reportedly won the MVP award.

Even though this is an hour later, I'll address this. Marmol was only going to be able to pitch 1 inning tonight. Knowing that, it doesn't matter that much which inning he threw. Both pitchers were going to have to shut down the Cardinals in order to win the game. Plus the 5-6-7 hitters were coming up for the Cardinals in the 10th. It makes more sense to hope Fox can shut them down there, and try to save Marmol's 1 inning for the 2-3-4 in the order.

Fontenot was put in so Howry could go 2 innings tonight (which looks even better now that the Cubs have 3 short relievers left, 2 who pitched yesterday in a game that has a possibility to go extra innings).

I think Lou wants Howry to go multiple innings, and that's why Fontenot had to come in. Of course it's going to be hard to do that if the defense behind Howry makes him throw a ton of pitches in inning #1. That still makes no sense because Ronny hit in the pitcher's spot right in front of Soriano who made the last out. Right, so that's where you have to stick the pitcher. The only spots open are the #4 spot and the #9 spot. The #4 spot is due up 3rd in the next inning, while the #9 spot is a ways away, so that's why Howry was put in the 9 spot, and then Fontenot was inserted at 4. I wouldn't be surprised to see Soriano go back on the DL tomorrow.

I think Lou wants Howry to go multiple innings, and that's why Fontenot had to come in. Of course it's going to be hard to do that if the defense behind Howry makes him throw a ton of pitches in inning #1.

8%

I'm disappointed in Rich's performance. I'm more disappointed in the way he's been handled by the incompetent boobs that run the show. I'm disappointed the pitcher with the third-best ERA in our rotation is being pointlessly jerked around because it isn't aesthetic enough for some. That .217 BABIP and 79.4 LOB% wasn't likely to continue though. If his strikeout rate had gone up even when that walk rate skyrocketed, it would have been better (and the LOB% would be more reasonable). Unfortunately, his strikeout rate has also been down so far this year.

Harvey's line against Kershaw this season: 6/6, 5 2B. Those happen to be the only 5 doubles that Harvey has this year. Even for a tiny sample, considering the pitcher and the hitter, that is very, very odd.

Agreed. Hill's pitches have been very effective when he has command, but you cannot have a walk rate of 7.64 BB/9 (as he did in ST) or 6.63 BB/9 (as he did in the 4 starts before tonight) and expect to continue to remain effective. We've been saying that with Zambrano the last couple years, and Hill has been quite a decent amount worse with his control than Z was in 06 or 07. BTW, his new total is now 8.24 BB/9 on the season.

It's hard to tell if it's rust, or if it's simply a continuation of the control problems that Hill has had for the past 2 months.

He was until his arm mysteriously went away over the offseason. Injuries could very well have made him completely done.

And there was a similar situation about a decade earlier with Mel Rojas. Very good setup man for the Expos. Signs huge deal to become Cubs' closer. Sucks big time as closer. Mel Rojas had been the Expos closer for a couple years when the Cubs signed him. He had 30 saves in 1995 and 36 saves in 1996 before joining the Cubs.

The first thing I thought when I heard this was if the Rockies may panic and trade for Brian Roberts. I doubt Cedeno or Theriot has built up much trade value, hot start or not.

I thought so as well, but apparently it counts: http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/definition_terms_2.jsp