Rob

Watching sombody write Meche into the #2 spot in the rotation made me vomit in my mouth a little bit. Meche is a decent #5 or a bad #4. He's not a #2 and never will be.

Seems the Yankees are just trying to get Petitte to hurry up.

Interesting...

But is he healthy? Yeah, a down year like that is enough to at least throw the maybe in there. It can't just be ignored. His peripherals are largely intact. I'm not worried about his performance.

Rumors earlier this offseason had the Mets turning down a Milledge for John Patterson deal. Pie, Marshall, and Marmol for Patterson and Church?

That's the problem, everybody just assumes that we could get as much from "the kids" as we would from someone like Lilly. Hill panned out, but who else was there? Well, let's go through last year's options: Marshall: Oft-injured, 5.59 ERA in 2006 Guzman: Oft-injured, 7.39 ERA (with Cubs) in 2006 Mateo: 5.32 ERA Marmol: Had to go on DL, 6.08 ERA If you think you can rely on those guys to do as well or even nearly as well as Lilly/Meche, you're really grasping at straws. Prior and Miller are also in the mix, but Prior will get hurt, and Miller has questions about his durability and stuff. If you go into next year with Zambrano, Hill, and three of the options listed above, you're accepting that the Cubs will be a lousy team again. That's fine, but don't delude yourself into thinking that this team would be in the playoff hunt. ... and you think Lilly and Meche are going to lead us to the promise land? ROFL I think out of those 4 guys you mentioned and Prior/Miller you get at least the production that Lilly/Meche +whoever would give you and probably better production. fine, but stats don't support this at all The stats also don't show Lilly or Meche being of much value to the team... let alone ten mil each. I'd rather roll the dice on the kids next season, seeing as how we're not a WS-caliber team even with Lilly and Meche. At least then we'd have a real idea of whether or not any of these prospects are going to pan out. If not, then we can grab some of the better starters on the FA market next year. It's not as if guys as talented as Lilly and Meche don't come along every year.

Or sign Bonds and Church and have a loaded offense. Still need pitching. And if they sign Meche and Lilly, they'll still need pitching. If those are the only legitimate choices (at the prices being mentioned), I go with the kids and stack the offense. What did "going with the Kids" get us last year? About as far as going with guys like Meche will get us in 07. I agree with the Meche part, but I like taking the chance with Lilly. Then you can always try to pry away another starter via trades. Lilly and Jennings even wouldn't be enough to make this a WS caliber team. That's an average rotation and an average offense. That makes us a possible contender for a wildcard, if things break right. I think we're in the same position the Mets were in after their spending spree pre 05. We're still a year off. The guys on the market just aren't going to be enough to change that.

Ewww

I am pissed.

With Schmidt off the board, I'd rather not sign Lilly or Meche. I didn't see us making a run next year without a legit top-of-the-rotation guy. Since we didn't get Matsuzaka, Schmidt's gone, and we aren't looking at Zito... we wont have one. Lilly and Meche wouldn't be enough to help put us in contention, so neither one on their own would be either. Throw the rookies out there next season and see who sticks. Make a run in 08.

So much for having a good rotation. No combination of available starters would pull that off at this point.

I don't know why we'd want to. Z Schmidt Hill Prior/Miller Lilly That'd be a pretty full rotation.

Murphy's Law?

Get used to the idea....it looks like that's what we're gonna get. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/161350,CST-SPT-cub06.article I already read that, hence the anger.

I hate Lilly and Meche... why would anbody in their right mind want those bums for 10 mil and not Schmidt for 15?

Do you value Mr. BB himself Carlos Marmol anywhere near Hill? Hill is ready to go NOW. Marmol has great stuff but is still a year or two away IMO. Strangely enough I put Mateo over Marmol RIGHT NOW. Can Marmol play shortstop? He has a higher career OPS than Izturis. He used to be an outfielder, if memory serves me correctly.

Do you value Mr. BB himself Carlos Marmol anywhere near Hill? Hill is ready to go NOW. Marmol has great stuff but is still a year or two away IMO. Strangely enough I put Mateo over Marmol RIGHT NOW. Hill > Veal > Gallagher > Pawelek > Guzman > Marshall > Marmol > Ryu > Mateo

Great idea, but don't you think Novoa should be used to acquire someone like ARod or Tejada? I'd trade him for a quarter-pint of jack daniels. Sadly, I doubt you could get that much. Surely there's some poor sap out there who paid good money for his jersey... perhaps he'd like to get the real thing to do his laundry for him.

I'm hoping he's really looking at Church, and not just trying to bring down Lofton's pricetag.

Great idea, but don't you think Novoa should be used to acquire someone like ARod or Tejada? I'd trade him for a quarter-pint of jack daniels.

OH, don't you bring your negative vibes in here, mandinga!! :wink: I wonder what Z wouild get on a free agent market like this. Depends. Is he gonna be a SP or a DH?

I'd do Marmol for Church inside of a heartbeat. Guzman, I'm not so sure about.

Schmidt, Soriano and Church would keep me from getting too angry. Agreed. Also, cutting Izturis and putting Theriot as the starting SS would go a long ways.

Matsuzaka, Drew, and Lugo... The Red Sox have gotten everybody I really wanted off the free agent market this season, aside from Aramis.

I'd be shocked if Manny would agree to be traded to Canada. :D But, anything to get Seattle out of the Schmidtstakes. Agreed. If they're out, I'd feel really good about our chances of getting him. While we're at it, here's praying Luis Gonzalez signs with the Dodgers.