BigbadB

I think the 40 page Bobby Howry thread was out of control. There have been hundreds (guess) of pages on Dunn with no basis for fact. How is this any different? In any case, none of it has any bearing on what actually happens, so what difference does it make? I apologize if that's not what you are getting at nolan, but I'm getting a little tired of hearing people say "Don't propose Dunn trades, it will never happen." So what? Who cares? This is an interesting philosophical discussion so whether it could happen or not is pretty irrelevant. I just think these threads are an excuse for members to argue with each other for absolutely no reason cause he won't be a cub. If you want to argue, argue about REAL POTENTIAL MOVES, OR MOVES WEVE ALREADY MADE. Where is the harm? You don't have to read the thread and you certainly don't have to respond.

Having no RF'er in its current state will put this offense back to '04 levels as well as counting on Lee to produce exact numbers as last year. It also seems as though people just assume that Aramis will actually stay healthy for a full year, too. Which is why Nomar's return should have been priority #1 this offseason. If Aramis isn't healthy, Nomar plays 3rd. If Furcal isn't signed and Cedeno is playing 2nd, Nomar plays SS. If we don't get an impact RFer, Nomar plays RF. If Aramis is healthy, we have an impact bat in RF and we have Furcal in left, Nomar would probably give us his blessing to move him to a team that would give him the opportunity to play everyday if we truly didn't have a spot for him. But, now I'm crying over spilled milk.

Izturis is injured. He may not be ready until midseason.

I think Murton earned a shot also. But, Michael Restovich appeared to earn a shot in the majors, yet he didn't. He can't stick on a team now to save his life. Once teams get a good scouting history on Murton, will he still be a .300/.350 hitter, or will he drop down to a .250/.325 guy? We just don't know. With an outfield of Floyd, Pierre and Bradley with Murton getting at bats against lefty pitchers, we have depth. Floyd and Bradley are better options to me than Murton. Floyd has just one year left on his contract. If Murton tears it up again this year, you can consider giving him an everyday job. With Floyd and Bradley's injury history, Murton should get a ton of at bats to prove his worth. If Murton is one of the 3 opening day starters with Mabry as the 4th outfielder, then Cedeno won't play. Fact of life with Dusty Baker as manager. I'd rather give Cedeno the everyday job on opening day if we have enough depth in the outfield that Murton is #4 on the depth chart. With Murton in left and Neifi/Cedeno at SS, I agree with another poster that you need an Abreu/Manny type in RF if they go this route.

If Vidro would have to pass a physical for the trade to happen, what's the problem?

I was hoping the story would go something like this: Sammy went into the clubhouse and brought Willie Wilson back out to sign the autograph. After Willie Wilson signed, the kid took out his chewed bubble gum (with Willie Wilson watching closely), placed it directly on the autograph, scrunched it up and threw it in the trash with the comment, "thanks I needed something to throw away my gum, and what better than a Willie Wilson autograph." :D

Exclude that whopping 1 yard drive against Tampa Bay in the first quarter, and the offense hasn't done much in quite some time. The writing is on the wall for him. He needs to make something happen whether the defense is keeping it close for him or not. This game has all the characteristics of a playoff game. Lovie knows it, and he can't just sit there and let the offense continue to struggle series after series. If Orton can't move the ball in this game, they need to put someone in there that can. They have capable receivers. They need a capable quarterback. I hope Orton is that guy, but he needs to make it happen early in this game.

As a 5th outfielder, yes. As a 4th outfielder, no. I was kind of liking the concept of adding Floyd and Bradley via trade, then Murton (platoon with Floyd), Hairston and Patterson (PH/utility) fill out the rest of the outfield. That's an offense that I would applaud Hendry's offseason. Assuming of course Cedeno and Walker are the middle infield.

I'll take no less than a 1st round pick for Andy Pratt. Line forms to the left. Walk, do not run!

I'd rather trade marginal talent and take on Floyd (much great offensive impact than Lugo) and Matsui (could hopefully keep Neifi on bench more often) while paying the money (which is still available), than trade significant talent for Lugo (which leaves a questionable OF of Murton, Pierre, Bradley(assumed)) with no OF depth. The Cubs still have money to spend on the roster. If they aren't going to get an impact player like Drew or Abreu, they might as well use that financial flexibility to their advantage. The two things you need to make a deal are money and talent. If you don't have much money, you have to give up more talent. If you have the money, you can give up less talent. If this fascilitates a Manny trade, NY could give the Cubs Floyd and Matsui for very little, just for the cost benefit. Knowing the Cubs would have to absorb a lot of the salary for Floyd and Matsui, what do you think it would cost in talent? We do have Hairston Jr., Walker, Novoa, Wuertz, Wellemeyer, Ohman and Patterson available, besides a much more limited supply of prospects.

How much cash is Boston picking up in this? Marte? I thought they were really high on this kid. :? Chipper Freaking Jones. Oh well, at least Marte won't be our problem from now on...to the AL he goes. I'm trying to find the article, but I read somewhere last week that he went from being BA's #1 overall prospect to being #4 in the Braves system within a few months. I don't think it was because Marte had slipped, but rather the Braves traded for good prospects (Davies) and another (Francouer) made such strides?

What would Tampa want for both Lugo and Huff, though? That could cost a bundle. All the good prospects will be in Florida, somewhere.

Wainright has been reduced to relief?

Tampa is rumored to have declined a trade that would have sent Andy Marte to Tampa for Lugo. Marte is considered one of the best prospects in the minor leagues. Now, with Tampa just trading for Sean Burroughs, would Tampa take lesser talent if it involved pitchers? Pitching is Tampa's gaping hole.

Florida doesn't have any room left for anyone. :D

Can Youkilis play SS?

Are the Dodgers really considering moving Drew? Hmmm.

I'd do it. NYM would have to pick up some of the salary. If the Mets truly want to pick up a 2nd baseman and leave Matsui rotting on the bench, they might as well move him. IF Matsui is healthy, of course.

all 3 were declined Were they still taking up spots on the 40 man prior to this? No.

I would have had more faith in Darren Baker than Jose Macias last year. I would have used Zambrano, Rusch and Prior in PH situations before I would have used Macias.

You're making me feel fuzzy inside. I want to hug CubbieRich now. :shock:

Yeah, I saw a report recently that Vidro might not play again. Although if I was Vidro, I'd at least attempt to play so that the contract continues paying.

Horrible sig. Get rid of it! I have changed Hendry's offseason grade so far from D- to C+ with just that one move.

True, but I'm still upset that it took this long. Ah, I'll worry about being upset later. :cheers: :fingerfight: :newkiss: :w00t:

Patterson does have 5 tools. He just hasn't put them all together. Maybe he will some day, maybe he won't. Did you hope he would fail while many of us cheered for him to succeed? So you can say "I told you so"? Are you saying that you hoped that Patterson would fail just so you could rub people's noses in it? Did you place more importance on this than the Cub's winning? Because you say so? I'm sold. :roll: BBB, I'm not really exuberant or unhappy about Juan Pierre, but I hope you enforce this "I told you" stuff if Pierre has a lousy season. Because I could see the same thing coming out of the woodwork. I'll enforce it any time I see it. Every Cub fan wants to see the Cubs win. That should be the bottom line. I'm not a big fan of this Pierre move, but I certainly wouldn't want them to lose just so I can say "I told you so". I don't think the "I told you so" stuff works anyway. I don't think it should take 3 years to evaluate every prospect. Every prospect is different. Every player playing the game today was a prospect at one point or another. It just seems like a rarity that the Cubs produce one themselves. I understand the bitterness. I understand the loyalty to hang on to those prospects, because they watched them develop all the way through the minors. A person shouldn't be persecuted for their belief in how a team should be constructed or when a team should give up on a prospect or bench an unproductive starter, etc... A person has their belief, and no matter how much or how many people attempt to blow their belief out of the water, nothing can make that person change that belief. There are still many people who have faith in Jim Hendry and Dusty Baker. I have no ill thoughts for those people, and those people shouldn't have ill thoughts on my belief that Hendry and Baker should be sent out of town tarred and feathered. No one knows how much of my life is dedicated to Cubs baseball, except my very patient wife. I live too far away to go to games regularly, but my time here and watching every game on TV shows my loyalty to the team I love. I'm sorry if what I think the Cubs should do doesn't mesh with someone else's idea of what the Cubs should do. Jim Hendry could care less about my ideas, so it doesn't really matter anyway. But, they are my ideas, just as much as your ideas are yours, and no one has the authority to be disrespectful of those who's ideas don't agree. I'm sure I have laid an insult out there a few times here and there. Sometimes even the most respectful of posters toe the line of decency on this board. A brain fart, a few too many beers, etc. I was a long time member of Cubs.com. It was the only place I knew. When Tim developed this site, it was the perfect place for me to set up camp. It has everything I want. Peaceful interaction with fans that have the same passion as me. Discussion, opinions, ideas, and experience on everything Cubs. I've learned a lot over the years. I have moderator status, but I have never let it go to my head. It's not really that big of a deal. If someone sees me passionately sharing my opinions, it's not my moderator status that is making those comments, it's the passionate Cub fan inside of me, just being like any other poster here. I want to be here when the Cubs win it all. I want you all to be here when the Cubs win it all, so we can share in the glory. We might fall over our walkers when it happens, but it sure will be a good day. The main thing is feel free to continue sharing your ideas, no matter how ridiculous I think they are :D . We're going to get real desperate for stuff to talk about once the offseason is over and there are still 2 months before pitcher's and catcher's report. That goes for all the lurker's out there who are afraid to post because someone might quickly come along to bash your opinions. The moderators have gotten together and decided that the personal insult penalties are going to be much stricter. The more this community grows, the more our long time members should be helping us keep this place friendly to everyone, except trolls and Cardinal fans of course. :D If that little soap box didn't bring a tear to your eye, I don't know what will. :pukel: