BigbadB

Someone has to carry Theriot's jock strap.

I didn't mind the Baker signing at the time. But, I evaluate baseball talent much more than a manager of a baseball team I never really cared to watch. Yes, he did take the Giants to the World Series. Giants fans were all over Cubs.com message boards telling us how bad of a manager he really is, and I didn't buy into it. Here we are today giving Reds fans the same welcome for Dusty as Giants fans gave us, and they too aren't buying that he could really be that bad. I was very upset with Dusty's in game management starting in '03. My support of him dwindled quickly. That Cubs team made it to where they were because of Zambrano, Wood, Prior and Clement, not Dusty. By '05, I was calling for his firing. I don't think you can really call it hindsight as much as learning that teams won games in spite of Dusty rather than because of Dusty. If I knew what kind of in game manager Dusty was, I never would have supported his signing (not that I really have much choice in the first place). However, I would expect the GM of a major league baseball team to know what a manager brings to the table and whether those things will win you more baseball games than you lose. Hendry failed in that aspect. If you honestly expect your GM to only know as much about a former manager as I do, then you are giving the GM too much of a pass. I'll take full guilt in originally liking the Dusty signing. But, Hendry is the guy who actually signed him. I honestly didn't think anyone could be worse than Don Baylor and Dusty proved me wrong.

And what have those three done since the trade though? Pinto has been somewhat decent, the other two, not so much. That's not the point. Even if all 3 of those guys were out of baseball by 2011, it still would have been a bad trade. When they were traded, they all had value. Value that should have been used accordingly. Actual value or perceived value? Unless you've been talking to a major league GM, then you have absolutely no idea what value they really had, other than what the Florida GM valued them at. Pierre sucked, no doubt about it. The trade wasn't near as bad as people like to make it out to be though. Ignoring for just a moment what those 3 prospects have or haven't done in a Marlins uniform, Juan Pierre should never have been a target in the first place. The failure to recognize that this team needed talented players to be added to the roster rather than a slap hitting lead off hitter is where the mistake began. Trading for a slappy lead off hitter making nearly 6m dollars and strapping the payroll from being able to add talented players is the second mistake. Including 3 cheap and young pitchers was the straw that broke the camel's back.

Aramis Ramirez and Kenny Lofton for Jose Hernandez, Bobby Hill, and Matt Bruback Todd Hundley and Chad Hermanson for Eric Karros and Mark Grudzielanek That is all. Couldn't agree more. Hendry's steals have worked out far better long term for him than his busts have bit him in the long run. I couldn't disagree more. Since Hendry became GM: The Tribune has upped Cubs payroll from 70m to 110m+ The farm system has gone from one of the top farm systems to the bottom and back to the middle of the pack Cubs record since 2003 is 407-403 while playing in arguably the worst division in baseball during that span. My expectations are a bit higher than yours, I guess.

Why isn't Crystal getting a tryout with San Francisco? Ah, I got it. Not old enough. :wink:

Here's a pretty amazing statistic: Take out the games DeRosa played at 2b last year, and DeRosa has more games logged at SS over the course of his career than he does at 2b. DeRosa played behind Furcal, Renteria and Michael Young at SS, but he was the popular SS replacement when those guys needed a day off. Theriot makes for a decent late inning defensive replacement for him, or spell him at SS when we need him in a corner OF spot or 3rd or 2nd.

Cedeno and Cintron sounds redundant, to me. They're the same guy. But I also realize Cedeno has no options. So, I guess I think one of them gets traded. This post sounds redundant to the previous post. :D

If Mark Loretta, Brendan Harris and Jeff Keppinger can do it, so can DeRosa. The Cubs are a better team if they add Roberts and move DeRosa to SS. The Cubs are a better team if they move Soriano to 2b, start Murton in LF and DeRosa to SS. The Cubs are a better team if Patterson plays 2b and DeRosa plays SS. The Cubs are probably a better team if they go with Cedeno at SS.

If that's true, then I'd be content with that depending on the prospect. Considering the Cubs would be doing Baltimore a favor in taking Payton and his bad contract off their hands, I don't see much need to add another prospect. Roberts and Payton = Gallagher and Cedeno Roberts by himself = Gallagher, Cedeno and maybe Veal. If it's the second deal, as much as I hate to see it, it would probably be Murton for Crisp. Why can't Oakland just pony up the cash for Crisp? They have Chris Denorfia penciled in CF for cryin' out loud.

Cubs must have had one or two of those sometime between after Sutcliffe and before Lieber.

I just think it was a poor choice to give up on him at 2b so quickly. Harvey is a whole new ballgame. If you can't hit, it doesn't matter what position you play. It's possible that Patterson is at a point where his defense won't improve. But, how bad could it really be? Derrek Lee is so good at 1b that he can make an average defender look good. And the Cubs have so many good defenders on this current team that it's a bit easier to hide a terrible defender. So, if DeRosa isn't an everyday starter at this point in his career, why not let Patterson grab some starts at 2nd? Both would or could be decent #2 hitters in the line up. Save the money to be spent on Roberts for a deadline or sooner deal for a SS. Theriot becomes the platoon partner for Pie if you really have to have one. Heck, Hendry probably could have gotten Towers to cave on Greene if he pestered Towers half as much as he's pestered MacPhail.

Hendry was one of the few GM's who had money to spend during that time frame. From '99 to '02, salaries and inflated contracts went crazy and DLee was one of them. I recall sometime in 2002 that there was a deal in place for Lee to go to Baltimore, but the deal fell through because Florida wouldn't pick up part of the contract. Lee was very much on the market. Florida practically dumped their whole team after their trip to the World Series, minus Cabrera and a few other cheap players. Just about every team in baseball was strapped with at least 1 really bad contract during that time. Hendry pawned his off on LA and the Trib has opened up the wallet a little more every year he's been the GM and he really doesn't have a whole lot to show for it. He's made some good trades. I won't deny that. But, the full body of work leaves A LOT to be desired.

And since I pretty much own this entire page of this historic thread, I'll add two more cents right here: Hendry's biggest problem is evaluating talent and recognizing where the actual holes in the line up are. I don't think there was a member of NSBB who couldn't recognize that Jeromy Burnitz would be a bust in a Cub uniform. Anyone who would look at what a guy did in Colorado the previous year and assume that he could duplicate those numbers outside of Coors is quite possibly a moron. And I almost have to say the same thing about anyone who is satisfied with Ryan Theriot at SS but feels like we need an improvement for DeRosa at 2b. Hendry signs a guy for 3 years to be his everyday 2b and a year later is looking to replace the guy he signed for 3 years. Meanwhile, over at SS, a guy who makes league minimum and provides league minimum offensive production has his job handed to him on a silver platter. If Jim spent half of the amount of time he has spent on trying to get Brian Roberts, he probably could have gotten himself a SS that could provide twice the production that Theriot provides. And Roberts cannot provide twice the production that DeRosa provides. And if he really is willing to cough up all this talent and dough for salary rejects like Ramon Hernandez and/or Jay Payton just so he can get his prize, why didn't he just swing a deal for a pitcher? And just how stupid was it to ever take EPatt away from 2b and stick him in the outfield? The guy is doing his time in the minors. That's where you learn to play the game. Who is it hurting if he makes an error here and there. Mistakes build character. Practice makes perfect.

The Cubs saved 2 million dollars even after factoring in Burnitz's salary, and as mediocre as Burnitz was the Cubs still upgraded quite a bit in RF from what Sammy was like that year. Burnitz was 27 points better in OBP, 59 points better in SLG, and played better defense. That ended up being a good deal for the Cubs. I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one. The Cubs devalued Sosa to nothing more than a couple of minor league throw ins while picking up most of his salary to play for someone else. It didn't have to become public knowledge that Sosa decided to leave a few innings early. Teams would have been much more interested in Sosa if the bad rep wasn't following him around at the end of that year. And that's part of my problem with Hendry. Rather than looking for ways to boost a guys value, he waits until their value is at its worst and then he moves them for little return. Same can be said for Maddux. Cubs weren't going to the playoffs. That's a given. But, I'd rather just keep Maddux for the last couple of months of baseball than trade him for a crappy utility infielder with next to no value. Why would you just give a player away like that? Especially to the team who swooped up Furcal out from under Hendry prior to that year.

Actually, it was Hee Seop Choi and Mike Naninni. But, that trade basically fell into Hendry's lap. Lee was on the market a full year before he was finally traded. Either no one wanted Lee's contract or very few could afford Lee's contract. Hendry had money burning a hole in his pocket and I just can't bow down at his feet for that one. The Aramis one fell into his lap even more than the Lee trade did. Pittsburgh was dumping anyone who made more than league minimum that year. Patterson got hurt, and practically the day after that Lofton and Ramirez were on a bus.

Mark Bellhorn for Jose Hernandez?

Juan Cruz and Steve Smyth for Andy Pratt and Richard Lewis?

And even though you mentioned it already, I still have to include it: Juan Pierre for Ricky Nolasco, Renyel Pinto and Sergio Mitre?

Corey Patterson for Carlos Perez and Nate Spears?

Jacque Jones and cash for Omar Infante?

Sammy Sosa for Jerry Hairston, Dave Crouthers, Mike Fontenot and basically paid for Sammy's entire salary.

Scott Moore and Rocky Cherry for Steve Tracshel?

Outside of Juan Pierre, I can't think of one trade that Hendry has made in which he got ripped off. And looking back out at it, it wasn't really a ripped off. And before people say what about Dontrelle Willis, I say Matt Clement was better with the Cubs then Willis was with the Marlins. So that wasn't really a ripped off. So, I don't get what Hendry gets a knocked for being ripped off in trades, when in reality, Hendry has made more good trades (even if they don't turned out as well as expected, ie Nomar) then bad trades. Now FA, that's a different story. What would you call Greg Maddux for Cesar Izturis?

Translated: You are mom is not a drunk. Wow. Someone is drunk.