Minor League Discussion & Boxes 7-21-13

[Guest]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

[Guest]

If anything, it's Ransom and not Valbuena keeping Vitters in Iowa. But I agree that I at least haven't given up hope on Vitters being a right-handed batter on the platoon side at 3B or a corner OF spot. If he can stay healthy the rest of the way I'd like to see him come up at some point after the deadline and at least get a few starts a week at 3B/OF against lefties.

 

I think he can play everyday. But as long as we're wazting seasons, why not find out if he can play corner OF.

 

Vitters turns 24 in a month. If he's going to have a career it's going to peak next year through 2018ish. All of those years will take place prior to him becoming a free agent, and most of it will be without arbitration inflating his salary. Him not racking up service time this year was a good thing. And again, the guy just got back from another long DL stint. He's got 81 PA this season and less than a full season at AAA combined. There is no rush to get him in the major leagues yesterday. Let him actually show something for a prolonged period for the first time in his career before a promotion.

 

he's got over 500 PAs of around .880 OPS at AAA, the only reason to keep him down there is service time, like you said, not that he's got anything to prove.

Sulley, .800 OPS isn't exactly setting the world on fire in a hitter's league that is inferior to MLB. I think we'd all like to see him turn into something, but he's still got a ways to go, especially on defense. If he can't play third I'm not so sure he all that attractive.

[Guest]

If anything, it's Ransom and not Valbuena keeping Vitters in Iowa. But I agree that I at least haven't given up hope on Vitters being a right-handed batter on the platoon side at 3B or a corner OF spot. If he can stay healthy the rest of the way I'd like to see him come up at some point after the deadline and at least get a few starts a week at 3B/OF against lefties.

 

I think he can play everyday. But as long as we're wazting seasons, why not find out if he can play corner OF.

 

Vitters turns 24 in a month. If he's going to have a career it's going to peak next year through 2018ish. All of those years will take place prior to him becoming a free agent, and most of it will be without arbitration inflating his salary. Him not racking up service time this year was a good thing. And again, the guy just got back from another long DL stint. He's got 81 PA this season and less than a full season at AAA combined. There is no rush to get him in the major leagues yesterday. Let him actually show something for a prolonged period for the first time in his career before a promotion.

 

he's got over 500 PAs of around .880 OPS at AAA, the only reason to keep him down there is service time, like you said, not that he's got anything to prove.

Sulley, .800 OPS isn't exactly setting the world on fire in a hitter's league that is inferior to MLB. I think we'd all like to see him turn into something, but he's still got a ways to go, especially on defense. If he can't play third I'm not so sure he all that attractive.

 

He's much closer to .900 than .800

[Guest]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

 

I can understand this, I just hate to think he's being stalled at AAA because of a bad cup of coffee in the majors.

[jersey cubs fan]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

 

I can understand this, I just hate to think he's being stalled at AAA because of a bad cup of coffee in the majors.

 

It was more like a poisoned cup than a bad cup.

 

But why do you keep ignoring the fact that he's only played 20 games this year because he's been out with injury again? He hasn't been raking for 3 months.

[Guest]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

 

I can understand this, I just hate to think he's being stalled at AAA because of a bad cup of coffee in the majors.

 

He's being stalled because he's had <100 PA this season due to injury.

[Guest]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

 

I can understand this, I just hate to think he's being stalled at AAA because of a bad cup of coffee in the majors.

 

It was more like a poisoned cup than a bad cup.

 

But why do you keep ignoring the fact that he's only played 20 games this year because he's been out with injury again? He hasn't been raking for 3 months.

 

He's had a full season at AAA, though, I think you're ignoring that. Most 23 year-olds that do that in their first year of AAA are up at theML level to stay. I understand if they're bringing him along because of the injury, but at some point, it's time to swim.

[Warpticon]

And that point isn't less than 100 PAs after an awful MLB stint, which seems totally obvious to everybody but you.

[jersey cubs fan]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

 

I can understand this, I just hate to think he's being stalled at AAA because of a bad cup of coffee in the majors.

 

It was more like a poisoned cup than a bad cup.

 

But why do you keep ignoring the fact that he's only played 20 games this year because he's been out with injury again? He hasn't been raking for 3 months.

 

He's had a full season at AAA, though, I think you're ignoring that. Most 23 year-olds that do that in their first year of AAA are up at theML level to stay. I understand if they're bringing him along because of the injury, but at some point, it's time to swim.

 

The dude has spent his career getting promotions after brief glimpses of looking good only to level out quickly at the next level. Frankly I'd like to see him perform at a high level in AAA for at least a month straight before giving him his next shot. I see very little reason in bringing him up until September, unless a lot of current major leaguers are dealt away and they need to fill a spot.

[Guest]

And that point isn't less than 100 PAs after an awful MLB stint, which seems totally obvious to everybody but you.

 

Jesus Christ lighten up Frances

[Guest]

They did bring him up last year, and he was shockingly bad(.395 OPS, 33 K in 109 PA). He's only had those 81 PA since then, so it's certainly possible that he hasn't shown the improvement he needs to in certain aspects(or shown them in a large enough sample) in order to justify bringing him back up.

 

I can understand this, I just hate to think he's being stalled at AAA because of a bad cup of coffee in the majors.

 

It was more like a poisoned cup than a bad cup.

 

But why do you keep ignoring the fact that he's only played 20 games this year because he's been out with injury again? He hasn't been raking for 3 months.

 

He's had a full season at AAA, though, I think you're ignoring that. Most 23 year-olds that do that in their first year of AAA are up at theML level to stay. I understand if they're bringing him along because of the injury, but at some point, it's time to swim.

 

The dude has spent his career getting promotions after brief glimpses of looking good only to level out quickly at the next level. Frankly I'd like to see him perform at a high level in AAA for at least a month straight before giving him his next shot. I see very little reason in bringing him up until September, unless a lot of current major leaguers are dealt away and they need to fill a spot.

Maybe, but my real problem is with people who have written him off as a non-prospect, even while he's hitting remarkably well at AAA as a 23 year-old. It seems like the better he gets, the more skeptical people are of him.

[Warpticon]

And that point isn't less than 100 PAs after an awful MLB stint, which seems totally obvious to everybody but you.

 

Jesus Christ lighten up Frances

 

Man, it's almost as if I was the one throwing a hissy fit over a player who was ass last year in the majors not being in the majors right now where he'd have no position to play every day anyway.

[Guest]

Buh. Dont you have some transforming to do or some weird japanese video game to reference?

 

Vitters wasnt ass at AAA last year, nor is he this year. Rizzo was really bad in his first go round, too. I guess he should have just fallen off the face of the earth.

[Warpticon]

Buh. Dont you have some transforming to do or some weird japanese video game to reference?

 

Vitters wasnt ass at AAA last year, nor is he this year. Rizzo was really bad in his first go round, too. I guess he should have just fallen off the face of the earth.

 

What a dumb comparison. Rizzo destroyed AAA for 3 months. Vitters has been pretty good for 3 weeks. Nobody said he should never get a shot again, but he hasn't done anything except have a good three-week stretch, and if he was in the majors he'd be playing like every 4th day anyway. Your degree of caring about this is kind of hilarious.

 

But yes, I like space robots and play video games, so I guess you got me there.

[Sammy Sofa]

Buh. Dont you have some transforming to do or some weird japanese video game to reference?

 

Vitters wasnt ass at AAA last year, nor is he this year. Rizzo was really bad in his first go round, too. I guess he should have just fallen off the face of the earth.

 

Rizzo's first stint in AAA:

 

.331 .404 .652 1.056

 

Rizzo's second stint in AAA:

 

.342 .405 .696 1.101

 

Vitters' AAA stints:

 

.304 .356 .513 .869

.271 .367 .459 .826

.306 .383 .514 .897

[wekim81]

Vitters sucks!

Vitters = Rizzo

 

VITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTERS

[Guest]

Buh. Dont you have some transforming to do or some weird japanese video game to reference?

 

Vitters wasnt ass at AAA last year, nor is he this year. Rizzo was really bad in his first go round, too. I guess he should have just fallen off the face of the earth.

 

Rizzo's first stint in AAA:

 

.331 .404 .652 1.056

 

Rizzo's second stint in AAA:

 

.342 .405 .696 1.101

 

Vitters' AAA stints:

 

.304 .356 .513 .869

.271 .367 .459 .826

.306 .383 .514 .897

 

The mention was really more regarding their struggles in the majors than their successes at AAA. the fact that I stated that Rizzo struggled wasnt to draw a comparison, but show that players we tag as "prospects" can have bad first stints in the majors, too, and that Vitters shouldnt be written off because he had a bad 100 PAs.

Edited July 22, 2013 by Stannis

[Guest]

Buh. Dont you have some transforming to do or some weird japanese video game to reference?

 

Vitters wasnt ass at AAA last year, nor is he this year. Rizzo was really bad in his first go round, too. I guess he should have just fallen off the face of the earth.

 

What a dumb comparison. Rizzo destroyed AAA for 3 months. Vitters has been pretty good for 3 weeks. Nobody said he should never get a shot again, but he hasn't done anything except have a good three-week stretch, and if he was in the majors he'd be playing like every 4th day anyway. Your degree of caring about this is kind of hilarious.

 

But yes, I like space robots and play video games, so I guess you got me there.

 

Yes, indeed you do like space robots.

[Guest]

 

The comparison was really more regarding their struggles in the majors than their successes at AAA. the fact that Rizzo struggled wasnt to draw a comparison, but show that players we tag as "prospects" can have bad first ztints in the majors, too.

 

My willingness to dismiss Vitters as a prospect has much more to do with the fact that he can't field (and isn't a good enough hitter to pull that off) than it does with his awful stint in the majors last year.

[Guest]

 

The comparison was really more regarding their struggles in the majors than their successes at AAA. the fact that Rizzo struggled wasnt to draw a comparison, but show that players we tag as "prospects" can have bad first ztints in the majors, too.

 

My willingness to dismiss Vitters as a prospect has much more to do with the fact that he can't field (and isn't a good enough hitter to pull that off) than it does with his awful stint in the majors last year.

 

At third he's no brazen beast, but he may be able to man a corner OF spot.

[Sammy Sofa]

Buh. Dont you have some transforming to do or some weird japanese video game to reference?

 

Vitters wasnt ass at AAA last year, nor is he this year. Rizzo was really bad in his first go round, too. I guess he should have just fallen off the face of the earth.

 

Rizzo's first stint in AAA:

 

.331 .404 .652 1.056

 

Rizzo's second stint in AAA:

 

.342 .405 .696 1.101

 

Vitters' AAA stints:

 

.304 .356 .513 .869

.271 .367 .459 .826

.306 .383 .514 .897

 

The mention was really more regarding their struggles in the majors than their successes at AAA. the fact that I stated that Rizzo struggled wasnt to draw a comparison, but show that players we tag as "prospects" can have bad first stints in the majors, too, and that Vitters shouldnt be written off because he had a bad 100 PAs.

 

But that's not the only reason people are down on him. It's a big reason, to be sure, but it's one of several. Bringing up Rizzo was rather pointless because his first terrible stretch in the majors was offset by the potential demonstrated by how he kicked the holy [expletive] out of the minors. Vitters, by contrast, is bad defensively and doesn't hit nearly well enough to justify staying at 3B or playing 1B or the OF. He's been "good" offensively at best in the minors when he needs to be a LOT better.

[Guest]

Again, theres just so much capriciousness in evaluations. Some prospects seem to not be able to hit worth a [expletive] at low A, yet they are excused for being young, while remaining atop rankings, while players like Vitters can be completely forgotten while excelling at AAA at the age of 23.

[jersey cubs fan]

The mention was really more regarding their struggles in the majors than their successes at AAA. the fact that I stated that Rizzo struggled wasnt to draw a comparison, but show that players we tag as "prospects" can have bad first stints in the majors, too, and that Vitters shouldnt be written off because he had a bad 100 PAs.

 

My predilection to doubt Vitters emerged long before his time in the majors.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I'm really surprised Cabrera came out of the bullpen for 2 innings. I wonder if it's just an attempt to limit his innings the rest of the season or if it's a permanent move.

This is what I'm wondering. I'm sure hoping we've not given up on him as a starter.

 

He pretty much did everything they could have hoped for in AA, so if it is a long term move, I'd guess it's because they feel as though they see him as a potential late inning guy in relief but more of a middling 4-5 guy as a starter. That or they just feel as though they'll have more need for him in relief than the rotation. Don't ask me how I came up with that expert analysis, just that I can't think of any other reason based on his AA stats.

[Guest]

The mention was really more regarding their struggles in the majors than their successes at AAA. the fact that I stated that Rizzo struggled wasnt to draw a comparison, but show that players we tag as "prospects" can have bad first stints in the majors, too, and that Vitters shouldnt be written off because he had a bad 100 PAs.

 

My predilection to doubt Vitters emerged long before his time in the majors.

 

But then people need to mention that instead of using his time in the majors as proof of anything.

 

But yeah, his doubters were out weeks before he was drafted, myself included. I wanted Wieters, too. However, Vitters has slowly developed into a hitter that should be able to stick in the majors for a long time, perhaps much of that time as an everyday player.