Defensive alignment and the shift

[Tracer Bullet]

Wyers article on the various metrics and how they're taking into account (or not) the effects of the extreme shirt the Jays use. Interesting read.

 

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=17183

[jersey cubs fan]

http://www.extremeanimals.biz/shirts/test_a.jpg

 

or something more like Ryan Braun would wear?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

That's awesome. This trend is long overdue and really changing the way baseball is played.

[jersey cubs fan]

This stuff runs the risk of being as useful as the RBI. Giving a player a better defensive ranking because his manager and coaches put him in the right place gives him credit for making plays others could have easily made if given the same coaching staff. Also, I wonder if MLB will ever try and make this sort of shift illegal. If offense keeps declining, with powerful pull hitters resorting to changing their swing or laying down bunts, and a bunch more plays being made that weren't before, they might feel the need to boost offense again.

[Tracer Bullet]

Tango tiger asks the question of whether the shift should be viewed in a similar way as the IBB. Do you penalize a pitcher bc his manager made him walk a guy?

 

It's good that metrics are trying to figure out how to deal with it. The more teams that start using the shift, the more relevant the data will become.

[Guest]

I'm not that familiar with the limitations of the technology, but I wonder if hit f/x and improvements around that would be able to help bridge the gap between defensive ability and positioning by recording that positioning.

[jersey cubs fan]

Tango tiger asks the question of whether the shift should be viewed in a similar way as the IBB. Do you penalize a pitcher bc his manager made him walk a guy?

 

I don't get the comparison. Who is being "penalized" in the shift situation? The hitter?

[Guest]

Tango tiger asks the question of whether the shift should be viewed in a similar way as the IBB. Do you penalize a pitcher bc his manager made him walk a guy?

 

I don't get the comparison. Who is being "penalized" in the shift situation? The hitter?

 

It confused me too, but that's what I'm thinking he meant.

[Tracer Bullet]

No one. Shifts benefit the 3b that's shifted bc he's credited for making more plays than his 3b counterparts that aren't shifted. Similarly, pitchers are penalized for IBB that the manager forces them to throw. In both cases, the credit/fault lies with the manager more than the player (though I think Wyers points out that Pena has bunted to the vacant 3b spot a couple times and those balls count against Lawrie bc they're in his zone and not fielded).

[TruffleShuffle]

Also, I wonder if MLB will ever try and make this sort of shift illegal. If offense keeps declining, with powerful pull hitters resorting to changing their swing or laying down bunts, and a bunch more plays being made that weren't before, they might feel the need to boost offense again.

 

they shouldn't have to do that. if big-time pull hitters keep getting robbed of hits by the extreme shift, all they have to do is lay down a bunt on the left side of the diamond and they have an automatic single. if they can slash a line drive the opposite way then it's probably at least a double. the onus is on the power hitters to adjust; if they continue to hit into the shift, then that's their choice.

[minnesotacubsfan]

its interesting. it suggests that the defensive player is independent of their position COMPLETELY. IT used to be, power @ 1b, 3b, RF, etc because thats where big guys could play. The Jays have an interesting take, albeit it could be off the deep end.

 

i wonder how this will develop.