dew1679666265

to be fair, his ERA is under 4.00 again after today, but yeah, he's not exactly a world champion 3rd starter Well to be even more fair, he's never been asked to be a No. 3 starter. He's been a pretty good number 5 guy IMO. Some days he gets rocked, some days he's OK, some days like today he's really good. Take a look at most teams fifth starter, not too many have an ERA under 4. Again, I'm not betting anything on any of his starts, but for a fifth starter he's been pretty good. how many teams have their 5 starter locked up for 3 years/21 mil Not sure about full contracts, but just this year here are some fifth pitchers being paid around the average of Marquis' contract: Red Sox - Matt Clement, $9.5 million Indians - Jake Westbrook, $6.1 million Mariners - Jeff Weaver, $8.325 million Oddly, ESPN has Marquis' salary this year at $4.75 million. Some of the fifth pitchers making around that much: Yankees - Kei Igawa, $4 million Cardinals - Kip Wells, $4 million Red Sox - Tim Wakefield, $4 million (the reason I listed the Red Sox twice is because I'm not sure if Wakefield or Clement was the fifth starter - Clement is on the DL)

What do we need another SP for? Every single one has done his job. Looking into a Playoff Rotation are you comfortable with anyone we have as our #3 starter. Zambrano is great, Lilly is solid, but after that I am little uncertain. Hill could easily run away with it with a solid August and September, but right now its anyone guess. I wouldn't pay a lot for another reliever unless the Reds demand Marshall in the Griffey or Dunn trades. Otherwise I'm fine with a Z, Lilly, Hill for the top three and then if Hill shows any sign of struggling, you've got Marquis and Marshall available in the pen. I'd say any of those three would be dependable for three innings or so. If we got a starter handed to us on a silver platter, though, I'd definitely be very interested. :D

The Dodgers losing would benefit the Cubs more. That way even if San Diego wins tonight they move into a tie with the Dodgers for the Division/Wild Card, and that would make it easier for the Cubs to possibly move up in the WC race this weekend. Dang, first I had to root for the Cardinals, now I have to root for the Mets. At least I get to listen to Vin Scully while doing it. :)

The Glavine/Lowe pitcher's duel didn't exactly pay off. Mets leading the Dodgers 9-5 in the bottom of the third. And the inning ends as Olmedo Saenz flies out to center with the bases loaded, Luis Gonzalez (I think) scores and Nomar is thrown out trying to advance to third. 9-6 Mets heading to the top of the fourth. What benefits the Cubs most in this game by the way?

I've never understood this sentiment. How do we know when he started taking steroids? Was it in 94? 98? Also, where do the non-steroids stats stop and the steroid influenced stats begin? Seems like if that were known, there would be an outcry to cut out his steroid influenced stats and go with only the non-steroid stats. I just don't understand how we can tell when he started using. we can't, which is why we should stop over-analyzing it to death Agreed.

You're right. This is all on Hendry for starting this mess in the first place. We should have never traded for Izturcrap in the first place. If I calculate correctly the total financial damage incurred by the Cub's involvement with Izturis is roughly $7.25M. Hendry sucks, he's just fortunate enough to have the payroll to outspend his mistakes. That's pretty horrid. Let's look at some of the wasted funds. Because it's always fun to stick a needle in one's eye. 2007 $4.25M -- Izturis $4.75M -- Marquis $3.00M -- Floyd $2.55M -- Blanco $5.33M -- Jones $3.83M -- Eyre $4.50M -- Howry $3.25M -- Rusch (might be insured since he could not play). While I don't disagree with most of the list, I have to wonder who in our minor league system could put up a 146 and 101 ERA+ with a 71:17 and 36:12 K:BB ratio the past two years? Those are Bob Howry's numbers as a Cub. Actually, I quite like Howry. He's been solid for us, all in all. But, our organizational strength is pitching. We have plenty of solid minor league pitchers who we control for a very long time, at a very low price. Why pay lots of money for relievers who are crapshoot anyway? I actually argue whether Howry is a crapshoot. Most of the time, relievers are very volatile, but Howry has been consistently good over the years. Before last year's 146, he had two consecutive years of 166 ERA+ and failed to top 100 in a healthy season only once: 2001 with the White Sox when he had a 98. How good he is depends, but he's always been good. I'll agree with this. While I was happy at the time to get Pierre (quit laughing), I thought we gave up a little too much for him. I didn't really mind losing Mitre but hated giving both Nolasco and Pinto. I wouldn't mind that strategy, though I think the power arms theory can work too. Going 100% either way is the only strategy I'm against. I think a variety of good arms is important.

I've never understood this sentiment. How do we know when he started taking steroids? Was it in 94? 98? Also, where do the non-steroids stats stop and the steroid influenced stats begin? Seems like if that were known, there would be an outcry to cut out his steroid influenced stats and go with only the non-steroid stats. I just don't understand how we can tell when he started using.

Atlanta's got Wickman and Andruw Jones this year, Tim Hudson and John Thomson last year. Oakland's got Eric Chavez, Jason Kendall, and Mark Kotsay. You can spend even larger amounts of money on high paid dreck too. The White Sox won a world series with a team full of middling salary guys and no superstars. The Cardinals did it the other way with a few studs, and the rest dreck. The Red Sox had a couple superstars, and then a bunch of role players. Don't overspend on bad players. Shocking revelation. Hudson - $8.5 million for a 126 ERA+ and a slightly more than 2:1 K:BB ratio. He's not overpaid dreck. Normally, Andruw isn't either but he's been pretty bad this year. I really doubt it'll last.

You're right. This is all on Hendry for starting this mess in the first place. We should have never traded for Izturcrap in the first place. If I calculate correctly the total financial damage incurred by the Cub's involvement with Izturis is roughly $7.25M. Hendry sucks, he's just fortunate enough to have the payroll to outspend his mistakes. That's pretty horrid. Let's look at some of the wasted funds. Because it's always fun to stick a needle in one's eye. 2007 $4.25M -- Izturis $4.75M -- Marquis $3.00M -- Floyd $2.55M -- Blanco $5.33M -- Jones $3.83M -- Eyre $4.50M -- Howry $3.25M -- Rusch (might be insured since he could not play). While I don't disagree with most of the list, I have to wonder who in our minor league system could put up a 146 and 101 ERA+ with a 71:17 and 36:12 K:BB ratio the past two years? Those are Bob Howry's numbers as a Cub.

Fox, Jones, and a couple others for Griffey or Dunn perhaps? :wink:

Some teams like having veteran depth during the stretch run as well. Lugo and Izzy have remarkably similar numbers this year. Both have exactly a .602 OPS and Izzy has about a 10 point advantage in OBP. Lugo, quite obviously, has been better throughout his career but the Sox may think he'd have a chance to be an upgrade this year splitting time with Lugo. If Hendry is willing to part with him cheaply, I think it may be a possibility. Lugo has been bad this year but at least the guy has been productive. Izturis with men on base has been horrible as in .100 avg horrible. Neither is meant to drive in runs though. This is a bit of a stretch I agree, but maybe the Sox are fed up with the lack of production from Lugo and are looking to give him some competition hoping to light a fire under him. If nothing else, Izzy is probably a little better defensively than Lugo - if both continue not to hit the rest of the way.

Some teams like having veteran depth during the stretch run as well. Lugo and Izzy have remarkably similar numbers this year. Both have exactly a .602 OPS and Izzy has about a 10 point advantage in OBP. Lugo, quite obviously, has been better throughout his career but the Sox may think he'd have a chance to be an upgrade this year splitting time with Lugo. If Hendry is willing to part with him cheaply, I think it may be a possibility.

Dang Mets. I'm already having enough trouble rooting for them. :evil: Now they get to try to come back against Trevor Hoffman.

Oh, it's possible. David Wright just cranked a 3-run shot to tie the game in the top of the 8th off Scott Linebrink!

Gotta love them starting Augie. Granted he's at the bottom of the order, but it's still Augie Ojeda on a team in contention. 2-8 in their last 10, fielding a lineup that honestly I don't see much difference over the Giants.... They were pretenders and are now done. I was just playin' around :) They can quit pretending after tomorrow, but for the remainder of this series they need to keep pretending like contenders. :) They havent' started pretending like contenders yet this series. Tonight would be a fine place to start. Works for me. :D

Gotta love them starting Augie. Granted he's at the bottom of the order, but it's still Augie Ojeda on a team in contention. 2-8 in their last 10, fielding a lineup that honestly I don't see much difference over the Giants.... They were pretenders and are now done. I was just playin' around :) They can quit pretending after tomorrow, but for the remainder of this series they need to keep pretending like contenders. :)

Still early, but the Brewers/Dbacks game is shaping into a pitcher's duel. Arizona retired in order in the second, Brewers coming up in the bottom half.

Ryan Braun picked off first with Prince Fielder at the plate! Still scoreless heading to the top of the second.

Gotta love them starting Augie. Granted he's at the bottom of the order, but it's still Augie Ojeda on a team in contention.

It all depends on what he defines as plays well. I would imagine that as long as the pitchers perform, and the rest of the lineup is good enough to keep them in contention, that it wouldn't take a whole hell of a lot from Kendall to please the powers that be. He could improve enough on his first half numbers (45 OPS+) to make them happy and still royally suck. I doubt Lou would be happy if Kendall sucked yet the pitchers were doing well. He was making unhappy comments about the Bowen/Hill platoon over the weekend and the team has been playing well and the pitchers performing (for the most part), yet Bowen and Hill were horrible. I do think Lou is willing to sacrifice some offense at catcher for better defense, but I really doubt Kendall brings enough defense that a horrible second half offensively will endear him to Lou. Also on Soto, do you think Hendry may like him but just not want to throw the pressure on him of a pennant race as he's trying to essentially break in? Granted this is pure speculation, but I wouldn't be terribly surprised if Kendall is horrible that Hendry goes with Soto to start next year - just doesn't want to heap the pressure on him (and perhaps doesn't trust him) in a pennant race.

Not necessarily. If Kendall struggles the rest of the season and somebody else steps up then Kendall may not be re-signed even with Hendry in charge. Hill has suddenly caught fire since the trade was announced. I don't expect that to continue, but IF it does that may influence the decision. He's had a couple good games. That's not likely to last. My point is I don't see anybody in the system who could possibly emerge to change their mind. What more could Soto have done to date to earn a shot? One point to consider is, would Lou want Kendall back if he plays terribly? Now, I kind of agree that all bets are off if Kendall returns to last year's form in the second half and puts up a solid to great OBP. But, if he ends the year struggling, will Lou put up with him? Hendry may full well want him back, but Lou will definitely have a say in who Hendry - or whoever the GM is - brings back. If Lou doesn't want somebody, he won't play them and I'd say Hendry won't bring back somebody Lou won't play.

Are you ready for this? Bases juiced, 2 out for Jones, who immediately falls behind 0-2. A few pitches later, he pounds a 2-run single off the glove of Klesko, and he then scored from first on Koyie Hill's 2-run double the next AB. No, I'm not joking. You did a much better job than me at explaining. :)

2-run single by Jacque and then 2-run triple by Koyie

This thread has a decent amount of photos. It was actually what prompted the poll in the first place. viewtopic.php?t=42383 http://www.northsidebaseball.com/PremiumForum/viewtopic.php?t=42383

Jesus Christ. Can we stop looking at OPS and OPS+ for two seconds? Is it so hard to admit that (like most players) he's not a power hitter? He hits for average and gets on base at a high rate. Why is this so hard to understand? Because hitting for average and getting on base isn't all that a hitter has to do. He has been average or worse as a player 5 of the last 7 years. So he won't be the perfect player, but he can provide us with a solid OBP - which people have been bemoaning the lack of for a very long time. He can't hit for power, ok he never could. But he can set the table either for Lee, Ramirez, Floyd (or potential big bat) or if he's low in the order he can set the table for Soriano and Theriot/Fontenot. Yes, that .260 OBP is solid - something... Obviously you've never played fantasy baseball. If you had, you'd know that the best way to pick players is to look at the stats they put up in the previous year. Yes, Kendall's OBP is less than average right now, but by the end of the season, he'll be back in the .360 range. A guy with a career .380 OBP doesn't suddenly drop to .260 for a full season. I've repeated time and again that he very well could suck the rest of the way. BUT, IF he can reach close to the .367 OBP he put up last year, I'll be happy. Is that a guarantee? No, but it's possible.