Backtobanks

My guess would be to try to use some of the money to outbid everyone else for Crawford.

The lack of position player development is an approach that I don't agree with but at least I see the logic in focusing on high-ceiling pitching. I guess it just seems so incredibly standard for a team out of the race to give players like Chirinos (or Castillo) and Smith PAs, if only because a hot month might turn them into an auxiliary piece in a trade. Yet here are the Cubs, passing them over for the likes of Bobby Scales. Of course this isn't the most detrimental oversight the organization has made, it's just so basic in my mind. I don't see the point in getting so worked up about this specific situation. September callups generally don't play enough to get really impact their standings. I totally agree, especially with Quade trying to win games and impress the front office. Scales and Fuld will probably pinch-run, Snyder might get a few PAs as a pinch-hitter, Shark may start 1-2 games, and Berg will pitch middle relief in a blow out game. Obviously, Shark will be the only one that might have anyone watching.

Unfortunately, that seems to be the problem with too many of the Cubs. Marmol, Byrd, Fukudome (for salary reasons) and Zambrano (for salary reasons) probably won't get you equal value in prospects.

I actually think his return could be more than his value to this team. He's far from irreplacable and hardly a difference maker. He's only been more valuable than Fukudome because of playing time issues. And he just turned 33. It really wouldn't take a huge drop in production for his value to be gone, like 2009. He's had a nice season, but he's probably getting praised for more than he's actually doing (the Mets announcers were slobbing all over him while disparaging guys like Fukudome and Ramirez - deservedly so on the latter). If the general consensus on Marlon is fairly high especially at his price you could get something significant for him and/or him and another player. After you list a multitude of negatives about Byrd, you then think some GM is going to give you "something significant" for him. Byrd is not a big-name player so I don't think any GM is going to give you anything signficant for him. He's been a very solid hitter for the past 4 seasons (all working with Jaramillo) and I don't see any reason to predict a huge drop in production.

I still don't believe so many posters think the Cubs are going into some kind of rebuilding mode. Byrd is cheap, productive, and certainly won't be traded unless they get an overwhelming haul from some team. I think Ricketts and Hendry are going to see all of the empty seats at Wrigley this month and reload with a team that can contend. As other threads have discussed, mix one part Dunn (or Pena) with a rebound season from Zambrano and Ramirez and possibly another starter, along with some maturity from Castro and Cashner and you're pretty close. It has nothing to do with rebuilding. A lot of people here I think are wondering if we've already seen Byrd's best season as a Cub. Another part of the equation is how far they're willing to go to get Colvin regular PT. That has nothing to do with rebuilding. What I was trying to say was they would need to have some sort of back up plan if Colvin turns out to be not so great next year. If they think Jackson might be ready to replace a struggling Colvin they would be more tempted to sell high on Byrd. You're right though, there's no way they trade Byrd who's said and done all the right things this year. That doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. Byrd's numbers this year are right in line with what he has done consistently for the past 3 seasons, so there's no reason o think there will be a huge drop in production next year. I think this was the exact same argument you used last off-season when I was advocating trading DLee and you wanted to keep him. Just like last year I didnt expect the Cubs to trade Lee, I dont expect them to trade Byrd this off-season. Sadly it is for the same reason though, not about good baseball sense but about appeasing the fanbase. Well if you think the Cubs are really going into a "rebuilding mode", then I understand possibly trading Byrd. My thinking is that Ricketts isn't going to wait 2-3 more years for a contending team and plans to contend next year with some younger players. Another reason for not trading Byrd is that the return would probably be of much less value than Byrd's worth to the team. He's not going to get you 2 very good prospects or a "can't miss" prospect.

I still don't believe so many posters think the Cubs are going into some kind of rebuilding mode. Byrd is cheap, productive, and certainly won't be traded unless they get an overwhelming haul from some team. I think Ricketts and Hendry are going to see all of the empty seats at Wrigley this month and reload with a team that can contend. As other threads have discussed, mix one part Dunn (or Pena) with a rebound season from Zambrano and Ramirez and possibly another starter, along with some maturity from Castro and Cashner and you're pretty close. It has nothing to do with rebuilding. A lot of people here I think are wondering if we've already seen Byrd's best season as a Cub. Another part of the equation is how far they're willing to go to get Colvin regular PT. That has nothing to do with rebuilding. What I was trying to say was they would need to have some sort of back up plan if Colvin turns out to be not so great next year. If they think Jackson might be ready to replace a struggling Colvin they would be more tempted to sell high on Byrd. You're right though, there's no way they trade Byrd who's said and done all the right things this year. That doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. Byrd's numbers this year are right in line with what he has done consistently for the past 3 seasons, so there's no reason o think there will be a huge drop in production next year.

I know Grabow sucked this year, but it looks like he was injured most of the year. He's a decent reliever assuming he rebounds from this year.

I'm not saying we should go after Butler, but he is only 24 years old so I would imagine his numbers will improve.

I still don't believe so many posters think the Cubs are going into some kind of rebuilding mode. Byrd is cheap, productive, and certainly won't be traded unless they get an overwhelming haul from some team. I think Ricketts and Hendry are going to see all of the empty seats at Wrigley this month and reload with a team that can contend. As other threads have discussed, mix one part Dunn (or Pena) with a rebound season from Zambrano and Ramirez and possibly another starter, along with some maturity from Castro and Cashner and you're pretty close.

Only speculation, but it sounds like Girardi is the favorite, followed by Gonzalez, with Sandberg coming in third.

Of course it didn't help much when they brought in Aramis and Xavier, but at least they didn't bring in Marlon.

Went to yesterday's game and the starting 8 position players were: Micah Blake Starlin Darwin Alphonso Kosuke Tyler Koyie I know names have nothing to do with ability, but you must admit those names don't exactly strike fear in your heart. :lol:

Is Mark Grace really one of the 20 best position players of the 90s?? .310/.385/.449/.835, 122 OPS+, 1754 hits and 364 doubles with 4 gold gloves is a pretty fair decade. He's obviously at the bottom of a top 20 of the decade, but I can't imagine that it would be a travesty or anything that he is there. I totally agree. If you're talking about just hitting and not power hitting because he played 1B, then he belongs in the discussion. Same with players like Gwynn and Ichiro.

but he wasn't a power hitting first baseman, so why penalize him for that? He was in that mold of first baggers like Will Clark and Olerud. Granted they both had a bit more power than Gracie, but they aren't Thome/Big Mac types. Would it have been nicer if he had more power? Hell ya. He still had a damn strong decade though. Also, you need to look at the role a player fills on the team. A 1B without power might be okay if the team is getting power from "non-power" positions (2B, SS, CF, C). The same argument can be made for Tony Gwynn.

Yes you do. Maybe you do, but I don't think I do. It's good to have confidence. You mean that you can't look at each ML roster and pick out their 4-5 best players and their 4-5 worst players without looking up advanced stats. In most cases (not all), you can use observation and the basic stats (BA, OBP, OPS, ERA, etc.) to figure out who the best players are and who are the worst.

Teams deal with more than just the top 100 players in baseball, though, and there's a big difference between a guy like Mike Cameron and a guy like David Eckstein. The advanced stats help to tell you just how big a difference there is, since batting average and other more traditional stats are, at times, misleading. Anybody who needs advanced stats to tell the difference between Mike Cameron and David Eckstein hasn't watched very much baseball.

Yes you do. Maybe you do, but I don't think I do.

I get bored by some of the more advanced statistical debates, but I also feel like looking at some advanced stats has made me much more knowledgeable and helped me to understand the game better. I'm not much of a math person either (I can do it for the most part, I just don't like it), but I enjoy using some stats more than just looking at average and counting stats. As for different people using different stats, that's part of why discussion is good. In many debates I've seen on this board, there wasn't really a "winner" and a "loser." It's much more laying out two points of view and seeing what can be taken from those points of view. I guess my point is that I don't need the advanced stats to figure out who the best (or worst) 100 players in baseball are. As for all the in-between players, it doesn't seem to make much difference to me.

From what I've seen (anecdotal, yes), the large bulk of fans tend to be casual. They root for the team, but don't follow it intensely. They simply either don't care enough to dig into the deeper stats (math isn't exactly a well-loved combo with hanging out watching a game for most people) or don't have the time. So they go largely off reputation, what they hear and which players seem to be trying hard at the times they watch. I don't think it's as much intentionally avoiding stats as it is not feeling that sports is an important enough area to focus large amounts of time pouring over numbers. I'm an avid lifelong (56 years) Cub fan and retired math teacher, but some of the arguments involving advanced statistics bore me to tears and seems to take the enjoyment out of baseball just to prove a point. Also, I've see many heated discussions here in which one poster uses one set of stats to disprove another posters stats on whether a certain player is good or not.

Or an 8 year contract.

Nobody is talking a 5 or 6 year deal. Everything I've seen suggests 3 or 4 years at $10-$12 per year.

Obviously depending on contract, but what would be wrong with that? Especially a 1 year deal which still leaves us a chance to get Gonz/Fielder Why would Konerko sign a one-year-deal after the year he's having? Right. Kind of my point as well. Weird fear to have for us to sign Konerko for 1 year to play first. If anything, it should be the White Sox fear that the season hes having would sucker them into giving him a 4 year extension. As for Dunn, does anyone else agree that if we were to sign Dunn, and Ramirez stays, wed probably be 1 solid starting pitcher and a few respectable relievers(preferably not at Hendry-esqu contracts) away from contention? Dewitt Castro Ramirez Dunn Soto Soriano Byrd Colvin P Looks like a hell of a lineup to me. I agree. I've been posting for a while that this team is not that far removed from contending in the NL Central. A career-average year by DLee, ARam, Zambrano, and Grabow would have made them contenders this year.

I think the Cubs would go after Pena if they don't get Dunn.

As I have often posted, Ricketts needs to put a competitive (maybe not contending, but competitive) team on the field to sell tickets. That's why I have trouble believing Aram or Byrd are going anywhere. Signing Dunn and a decent starter with a rebound season from Zambrano and Grabow makes them competitive enough to sell tickets and possibly contend for the NL Central.

I don't think that would ever happen. I think Sandberg will leave the Cubs if he doesn't get the job, especially if the new manager is young.