illiniguy

Wish Lee would have taken a pitch before Ted had to go back out.

How should we react? Are things going well? I think there is plenty of reason to be concerned. Yes, plenty of concern. Plenty to be optimistic about too. Is the season over as many have said in this thread and all over the board? I wish. That would put us in the playoffs.

How should we react? Are things going well? I think there is plenty of reason to be concerned.

How should we react? Are things going well? I think there is plenty of reason to be concerned.

we won't. Soriano already hit his flyball last at bat.

At what point should we start to panic?

Ted Lilly and his 85mph crap sucks.

Collapse? They had a 1-0 lead, hardly a collapse No the season would be the collapse.

Nice series guys. How the hell do you let Clark beat you?

Why do we even bother playing the games in Arizona? We never win any of them.

No clue. I know he's been working closely with the catching instructor down in Mesa (Kerry Wood's catcher from high school) but he's it seems like he's been DHing for about 2 straight weeks. I don't mind him DHing since he left games for a defensive replacement by the 6th or so when he caught and this way he'll get more at bats. He'll have more than enough time to work on catching in instructs this fall and extended spring training next season. His plate discipline has been unreal (51 at bats: 9 BB and 7 strikeouts). He seems to have a great grasp of the strike zone, especially for a high school draftee. How the hell did we end up with a high school kid who has plate discipline?

We keep this up we will be in thrid place by the time the Marlins series is over. Since we can't ever beat them either.

To the poster who gives all the credit to Dave Duncan improving these pitchers by teaching them a plan. What happens once they leave and go back to sucking? Does Dave have one of those Rays like on Men in Black?

You are gonna be watching us and the crew.

Yeah, that or you don't want to admit when you are wrong. With all due respect, the standings tend to agree with me. And when the regular season ends, that is all that matters. Not who over/underachieved or whatever else you want to call it. I am sure they will, much like they did last year. When the season ends, if the Cardinals are ahead of the Cubs are you still going to say the Cubs are a better team? Nope, but I know that isn't going to happen. Your team will fall off at the end just like it did the last few years. Even the year you won it all you faded big time. That's what happens when guys who overacheive start to play back to norms, I doubt this year will be any different.

Yeah, that or you don't want to admit when you are wrong. With all due respect, the standings tend to agree with me. And when the regular season ends, that is all that matters. Not who over/underachieved or whatever else you want to call it. I am sure they will, much like they did last year.

Maybe he should go the cardinals, get some hgh, and learn to "team" it up.

Yeah, that or you don't want to admit when you are wrong.

Look at the run differential. The Cubs' pyth. record is 60-38, the Cardinals' is 53-47. By the way.. the "the Cards would be in first if their bullpen was the same as last season" argument is a pretty weak one. What does last year have to do with this year? If the Rockies played the same as they did last year, they'd be in first place. It doesn't work that way. Anyways, you could also pick parts of the Cubs team (Rich Hill comes to mind) that haven't performed like last season and say "well, the if so and so played like last year, the Cubs would have an even bigger lead over the Cardinals". You can say that with pretty much any team, so it's pretty weak, especially considering your bullpen was pretty flukey last season to begin with. My point was that things change in baseball and excuses can be made for any situation, not that the Cardinals necessarily should be in first right now. At this point in the season, you can't legitimately label a team a fluke anymore. As far as the overachievers on the Cards, I wouldn't label Ankiel a fluke. As he was switching to a hitter from a pitcher he hit everywhere he played. He came up last season and hit very well. He has some holes still and makes some bad plays but he is technically a rookie now. At one point Ludwick was highly regarded and injuries derailed his career until now. He played well last year and improved upon that this year. Wellemeyer came out of nowhere that's for sure. I don't think you can call Glaus an overachiever either. His career averages in injury free seasons are pretty similar to what he is doing right now, he is just finally healthy again. Aaron Miles isn't that great, hasn't been this season. He has been opportunistic and has some clutch hits but either he gets a hit or an out pretty much, his OBP is barely above his BA and his defense leaves much to be desired, and Molina has steadily improved each season since he became the starter. Yes, they are doing more than what was expected at the outset of the season so if that is overachieving then I guess they all are. Yeah that would be the definition of overacheiving. Glaus has been on a downward trend since'02. This year after an offseason where he was implicated as buying HGH, he gets better. Ludwick was going to quit, because he was done. His wife talked him out of it and two years later he is an allstar with you. Ankiel went from pitching to hitting. He has more homers than any Cub. I guess I should expect our wash out stud pitcher Prior to start playing centerfield for us any day now. Aaron Miles isn't a big leaguer, but he is hitting walkoff grandslams for you. So how long do they have to put up these numbers to not be considered a fluke? Ah the guys with over 2500 career at bats probably awhile. Let me guess you think Tony Womack's '04 year, for you big suprise, wasn't a fluke? After all he had 500 abs that year. Sure his other 6000 at bats he sucked, but that's just splitting hairs. :banghead:

Look at the run differential. The Cubs' pyth. record is 60-38, the Cardinals' is 53-47. By the way.. the "the Cards would be in first if their bullpen was the same as last season" argument is a pretty weak one. What does last year have to do with this year? If the Rockies played the same as they did last year, they'd be in first place. It doesn't work that way. Anyways, you could also pick parts of the Cubs team (Rich Hill comes to mind) that haven't performed like last season and say "well, the if so and so played like last year, the Cubs would have an even bigger lead over the Cardinals". You can say that with pretty much any team, so it's pretty weak, especially considering your bullpen was pretty flukey last season to begin with. My point was that things change in baseball and excuses can be made for any situation, not that the Cardinals necessarily should be in first right now. At this point in the season, you can't legitimately label a team a fluke anymore. As far as the overachievers on the Cards, I wouldn't label Ankiel a fluke. As he was switching to a hitter from a pitcher he hit everywhere he played. He came up last season and hit very well. He has some holes still and makes some bad plays but he is technically a rookie now. At one point Ludwick was highly regarded and injuries derailed his career until now. He played well last year and improved upon that this year. Wellemeyer came out of nowhere that's for sure. I don't think you can call Glaus an overachiever either. His career averages in injury free seasons are pretty similar to what he is doing right now, he is just finally healthy again. Aaron Miles isn't that great, hasn't been this season. He has been opportunistic and has some clutch hits but either he gets a hit or an out pretty much, his OBP is barely above his BA and his defense leaves much to be desired, and Molina has steadily improved each season since he became the starter. Yes, they are doing more than what was expected at the outset of the season so if that is overachieving then I guess they all are. Yeah that would be the definition of overacheiving. Glaus has been on a downward trend since'02. This year after an offseason where he was implicated as buying HGH, he gets better. Ludwick was going to quit, because he was done. His wife talked him out of it and two years later he is an allstar with you. Ankiel went from pitching to hitting. He has more homers than any Cub. I guess I should expect our wash out stud pitcher Prior to start playing centerfield for us any day now. Aaron Miles isn't a big leaguer, but he is hitting walkoff grandslams for you.

You know you are right. Aaron Miles should get way better after he hits the age of 34. Ryan Ludwick should come up after being a career minor leaguer and be an All-Star. Yadier Molina should hit 50 points higher than he ever has. Also did you ever stop to think maybe your bullpen was lucky last year? There is no one in that pen I would want on our team. Not a one. They should suck ass. So should your lineup. Hell so should your rotation. But, per usual your team is overacheiving. So you're saying that no one on the Cubs is overachieving? Edmonds? Theriot? Lilly? DeRosa? No offense, but I already knew the kettle was black. Jokes aside, obviously you are set in your thinking and that's fine, I'm not trying to convince you otherwise. Oh yeah Ted Lilly is overacheiving this year. Good one. Have you looked at his numbers. He has been below average, but our offense has won him a few games. DeRosa is doing just what he did last year with a few more homers. Theriot is overacheiving, but makes up for it by running into more outs than anyone else in baseball and playing a crappy shortstop. Edmonds is a three outcome guy who kills us on defense. Yeah he is kinda doing more than I thought he would. Go ahead and explain these years to me. Todd Welleymeyer Kyle Loshe Aaron Miles Rick Ankiel Ryan Ludwick Yadier Molina Skip Shumacker Troy Glaus Notice I am not challenging Pujols, he is great and will have some monster years.

You know you are right. Aaron Miles should get way better after he hits the age of 34. Ryan Ludwick should come up after being a career minor leaguer and be an All-Star. Yadier Molina should hit 50 points higher than he ever has. Also did you ever stop to think maybe your bullpen was lucky last year? There is no one in that pen I would want on our team. Not a one. They should suck ass. So should your lineup. Hell so should your rotation. But, per usual your team is overacheiving.

'Cept for Corey Hart, who I would like to reiterate is one ugly s.o.b. He's ugly, but talented. The Cardinals are amazing and even Fox hinted at it yesterday. Talking about some of the jokers that played second base for them and outperformed what should be expected. They threw out Bo Hart and had a chuckle about it.

Right, luck has nothing to do with every single thing you guys needed to go right actually going right. Let me guess your guys just "wanted" it more, or came together as a "team." You notice none of us are like, how are the Brewers doing this? They are a good team. They should be playing well.

And 2 years younger. These Cardinal fans are great. Yeah your stats prove me worng, but we have Mystique and no name talent who play as a team to win. Or maybe you are due for a terrible stretch that your lack of talent can't really prevent. The guy who compared Aramis to Glaus and came up even sure is looking at things objectively. Oh and Soto and Ankiel are pretty similar if you don't mind a guy never taking a walk. But, really look deeper than the first four. Which you screwed up doing since you forgot our best player. Who we haven't had in over a month. Take a look at the DeRosas and Theriots vs. Miles and Ryans. That is where you see how our offense is better. That isn't even taking into account our pitching staff vs. yours. I think Milwaukee exposes you some this week.