Rob

Right on, man! All this twaddle about "stats" is just one more attempt by our oppressively monolithic Western culture to subvert your deep-seated natural instincts and to denigrate the rightful primacy of your sociocultural background and condition by subjugating you with it's fascistic "ideas" and "facts." This cult of heartless, dreamkilling fascists plots to rip us out of the rich cultural tapestry into which we were born, and to rend us from the abiding connection to our cultural roots which is the source of all truly abiding nourishment and sustenance. Thousands of endangered sac bunts die every day, and what do we do? But you can see through this--you and perhaps you alone can see through their imperalistic claims of "objective truth" and obsession with illusory "facts." You and perhaps you alone can see that they wish to tear you from your natural impulses-- the exhilaration of exciting plays unmediated by reflection. You and St. Morgan may be our last hope-- to protect the sanctity of pristine baseball-in-the-moment experience and anecdotes-around-the-fire from the fetid conspiracy of these boot-licking statistics lovers! Down with the fascism of facts! Or not. I love you.

Increases the market for our excess relievers, I like it.

That's half the fun. Speaking of which, I'm completely sober at the moment... but we'll have to see if it's still that way in an hour.

I hope he's open to a bench job.

Is anybody else getting the distinct impression everybody in here is a little tipsy?

Tim, kc, Fergie... I think we all just proved we are way too geeky to ever understand baseball. We might as well call it quits now. It's useless to even try anymore...

Im a math major. 12 ! = 479001600 Stupid coding fighting stupid math principles. 12 =/= 13 ?

I didn't assume a decline. You're right I didn't use EqA to justify my claims. Oh wait... being risk adverse won't help you win in the playoffs. 17 16.26794258 15.56740917 14.89704227 14.25554284 13.64166779 13.05422755 12.49208378 [/b] Woohoo, my brain is as smart as Excel!!!! Seriously, life and especially work is debilitating without Excel. God, that is nerdy. Ummm... did you miss third grade math class? 12.49 rounds down to 12. 12 != 13 You were way off.

uh somewhere in this thread theres a point i made where 122 games of JD Drew is a heck of a lot better than 162 games of Soriano in CF. Unfortunately, you failed to provide any facts to support your argument. Last year 162 games of Soriano was >>> than J.D. Drew. I think we need to stop assuming that age automatically equals decline in production. Soriano is only 30 years old. It is possible that he can continue his better numbers over the next few years. Hahahaha...that's a completely ridiculous claim if you've read the whole thread. KC has provided a ton of facts to back up his case. There's still room to disagree with his case and provide facts to counter it, but he has provided a lot of factual information to back his opinion. To claim otherwise is to disrespect the work he has done here and lower your own credibility. Sorry, I'm trying to keep up with the whole thread. Look no further than last year when they both played the whole season and I would take Soriano's numbers over Drew's any day of the week. Looking no further than one year is gonna screw you over mor often than not. 2 of the last 4 years Drew has played 100 or less games. 2003 Drew 100 games 15 HR 42 RBI .886 OPS Soriano 38HR 91 RBI .863 OPS 2005 Drew 15 HR 36 RBI .932 OPS Soriano 36 HR 104 RBI .821 OPS Cleary more games with Soriano is much more productive than less games with Drew. What happened to 2004? :lol:

Drew 2003 - Cardinals 2004 - Braves 2005 - Dodgers 2006 - Dodgers 2007 - ? Soriano 2003 - Yankees 2004 - Rangers 2005 - Rangers 2006 - Nationals 2007 - Cubs Seems like they're both about to be on their 4th team in 5 years. Best. Post. Ever. AlphonsOWNED I'd take a bow and all, but... you know... the internet. At any rate, it's fun to use statistics that can't be argued against.

I get the distinct impression there's no purported interest in him by any teams because it'sjust assumed he'll re-sign with the Dodgers on a low base incentive laden deal a la Wood. That's just my impression though. Take it for what it's worth.

Drew 2003 - Cardinals 2004 - Braves 2005 - Dodgers 2006 - Dodgers 2007 - ? Soriano 2003 - Yankees 2004 - Rangers 2005 - Rangers 2006 - Nationals 2007 - Cubs Seems like they're both about to be on their 4th team in 5 years.

You'll have to forgive me for not thinking. Between the two papers I'm simultaneously writing while trying to keep up with this the Soriano stuff, my head is fried. On a side note, I might be the only person here who's read every single post in this thread.

I'm having fun. :thumleft: (don't these things make non-premium people curious what the heck this is for or what it looks like?) They most certainly do... but not like $50 curious. (Sorry Tim, broke college student here) Aw, c'mon...it's like eating at the dorm instead of McDonald's one time each month! Maybe if you gave me a free week and I would become hopelessly addicted... I guess we'll never know though.

I'm having fun. :thumleft: (don't these things make non-premium people curious what the heck this is for or what it looks like?) They most certainly do... but not like $50 curious. (Sorry Tim, broke college student here)

he is a good player, but he's also overrated. he's being paid like one of the best players in baseball, and he clearly isn't. How is he overrated? Please no stats involved. Your opinion. And I agree with you that he doesn't deserve to get a $136 million dollar contract. But I will never consider him to be overrated. i think jacque jones is better than albert pujols. prove me wrong...oh, and please no stats involved. Pujols is the games best fastball hitter. He has great plate discipline, plays a solid D at 1B, gets on base, hits for power, hits for a high average, team player, and he runs the bases well. And he has a MVP award. Qualifiers like "best" "great" "solid" "high" and "well" are just rudimentary stats... they're obviously a ranking relative to the rest of the league. And that MVP award is certainly a stat. So basically your argument for Pujols over Jones without using stats is that he's a "team player." I propose to you that Jacque Jones is on a team as well. This debate is a draw.

Exactly. This signing is only cost prohibitive if the Cubs make it so. If they refuse to spend to sign other players because of this contract, then obviously it will be harmful. If it doesn't effect their spending too much, then it will probably be alright. There's no hard cap here. The Cubs can do whatever they want. This signing says to me that they are going spend more than they have in past. If that's the case (it's clearly pure speculation at this point), I'm not really worried about the money. All signs (articles) point to JH not slowing down. I have no doubt JH will sign atleast 2 pitchers of the quality of a Westbrook at a Meche. Since when is Meche quality?

Personally, I don't think we'll ever see Jones in CF. But Lou said he's playing Soriano in a corner outfield spot. Couple that with Bruce Miles' assertation that Soriano would be in right, Murton is "safe" and Jones moves to CF... it's pretty much given that Soriano is in right now. I think Jones will be moved, maybe as soon as tomorrow morning. But with Lou saying he wants Soriano in the leadoff spot, I don't see us bringing back Pierre or going after GM Jr. anymore.

Pending a physical Soriano is a Cub. 8 years for 136 looks to be the maximum years/money. Rumors around that the last 2-3 years might be option years (no idea whose) and that approx 90 mil is guaranteed. Everybody who doesn't like the signing is negative and Jim Hendry just can't get the props he deserves. Everybody who does like the signing doesn't understand statistics or finances and needs 10 more years of school. I'm bitter and sarcastic (for the last few comments at least) what about those of us who don't like the terms but like the signing anyway? Throw me into that catagory as well. In actuality, I think everybody is in that category. Nobody here has argued Soriano isn't an upgrade. He most certainly is. The only question is whether his contract has enough of a negative impact to be a hassle now or in the future. Some people feel more strongly than others that it does or does not. That seems to be the only divide. If the only question was "would you want Soriano on your team" everybody would say yes.

Pending a physical Soriano is a Cub. 8 years for 136 looks to be the maximum years/money. Rumors around that the last 2-3 years might be option years (no idea whose) and that approx 90 mil is guaranteed. Everybody who doesn't like the signing is negative and Jim Hendry just can't get the props he deserves. Everybody who does like the signing doesn't understand statistics or finances and needs 10 more years of school. I'm bitter and sarcastic (for the last few comments at least) what about those of us who don't like the terms but like the signing anyway? You don't exist.

It was only copy/paste, had this come later in the week when boredom had fully set in though..... Ha, that's where we differ. I'm bored already. I'm hoping for more Cubs moves this week to keep me occupied. ;) Correctamundo. More Cubs moves, please. its like fricken heroine. If you don't know how to spell it, you certainly don't know how to inject it into your forehead while on somebody's doorstep.

Pending a physical Soriano is a Cub. 8 years for 136 looks to be the maximum years/money. Rumors around that the last 2-3 years might be option years (no idea whose) and that approx 90 mil is guaranteed. Everybody who doesn't like the signing is negative and Jim Hendry just can't get the props he deserves. Everybody who does like the signing doesn't understand statistics or finances and needs 10 more years of school. I'm bitter and sarcastic (for the last few comments at least)

Yeah, I'll go ahead and say it too. If we were going to be unable to sign Drew or make a trade for a guy like Manny or ARod... this would be an essential move. I'm just upset we went straight to a 'A-' option rather than go for the A or A+ guys. And yeah, Shapiro had some very nasty things to say bout Peralta's range and that he was looking for an excellent defensive SS to back him up.

Yeah, seriously. It's funny, people are taking my comparison of Walker to Soriano and twisting it into an absolute that I'm claiming Walker is better or close enough to be worth the same amount... all I was pointing out is that Soriano isn't 130 million dollars better. At the same time, people are blaming the other guy for even bringing it up. Craziness.

Got me. someone was laughingly trying to compare their numbers. Hell, you're the one that brought him up, I guess that gives me the answer right there. Actually, I brought him up. I thought it was hilarious that Walker outperformed Soriano in 04 and 05 while they both played the same position, even though Soriano was in Texas in a better hitter's park than Wrigley. I'm not all that convinced three years of age and a career year prior to free agency is worth 130 million over 8 years more than Walker. But I guess that's an inconsequential concern worth being laughed over. Ha ha! Freaking hilarious! :roll: