CubinNY

No, it's actually not. The league average for the AA and AAA leagues ranges from .247 to .269. So again, it's wrong to say that Pagan can't hit. About how many prospects hit .250/.260 for their minor league career and make it to the bigs? I have no idea... but what does that have to do with anything? We're talking about Pagan, who isn't a .260 hitter. He's a .282 career minor league hitter - which is good, whether you want to admit it or not. Good question. 25 man roster complications for the Mets, I would guess. And I'm not saying that he's "so good." I am saying that he can hit though. And that's all I have been saying in this thread. That's the only thing in Jon's post that I took issue with. You are comparing Pagan to a bunch of guys that never make it to the majors and proclaiming that his numbers are good. Here's an analgoy compared to an 80 year old I am a pretty fast runner. Hitting .282 for a 5 or 6 year career in the minors is bad. It's just slightly above terrible, given his other offensive numbers. Using minor league averages as a bench mark for a prospect is not valid. Come on, hitting .282 is not bad, there are plenty of guys that make it and hit .280 in the minor leagues. However, that .280 isn't exactly a strength, in order to be a guy who's going to "hit for average" as a major leaguer, you need to do better than .280. As it pertains to Pagan, he does not get on base or hit for any power, and since he doesn't hit for enough average for that to be a particular strength, you have a pretty crummy offensive player.

No, it's actually not. The league average for the AA and AAA leagues ranges from .247 to .269. So again, it's wrong to say that Pagan can't hit. About how many prospects hit .250/.260 for their minor league career and make it to the bigs? I have no idea... but what does that have to do with anything? We're talking about Pagan, who isn't a .260 hitter. He's a .282 career minor league hitter - which is good, whether you want to admit it or not. Good question. 25 man roster complications for the Mets, I would guess. And I'm not saying that he's "so good." I am saying that he can hit though. And that's all I have been saying in this thread. That's the only thing in Jon's post that I took issue with. You are comparing Pagan to a bunch of guys that never make it to the majors and proclaiming that his numbers are good. Here's an analgoy compared to an 80 year old I am a pretty fast runner. Hitting .282 for a 5 or 6 year career in the minors is bad. It's just slightly above terrible, given his other offensive numbers. Using minor league averages as a bench mark for a prospect is not valid.

Murton's fate is very tied to anyone with a pulse on the roster who could conceivably play LF. Might not be fair, but that's the deal right now. Murton's problem is baseball philosophy. Not his, but those who currently run baseball teams. He is (or was) a patient line drive hitter capeable of a great BA and OBP but not a lot of SLG. But he plays a corner outfiled position where he's supposed to be a power hitter. He doesn't fit Dusty/Hendry's mold. Imagine if Mark Grace came up today. That's Murton.

No, it's actually not. The league average for the AA and AAA leagues ranges from .247 to .269. So again, it's wrong to say that Pagan can't hit. About how many prospects hit .250/.260 for their minor league career and make it to the bigs? To move up you need to be way above average and .282 isn't that, especially with his OBP and SLG numbers. If he's so good, why did the Cubs get purchase him for $10,000? This isn't MLB numbers we're talking about. Pagan has had limited experience in the bigs. His minor league numbers say he's not that good. Maybe he'll be one of the few who break the trend and make it, but I wouldn't put any money on it.

Can't hit? He's a .282 career hitter and can't hit? Can't hit for power would be more appropriate, but it's flat out false to say that he can't hit. .282 for a career average in the minors is pretty bad. Especially with those peripheral numbers. His numbers stink, the Cubs purchased him for $10,000 from the Mets.

U of M has the same problem as the Cubs. Head coach. Carr is outcoached every game. Go Columbia Lions!

Cubs stink.

It's not that I'm adamantly opposed to Carlos Lee. I just disagree strongly with people who insinaute he's a no brainer. My baseball related attention span has shrunk a lot this year, so I'm not sure what is available. But I wouldn't have a problem trading assets to fill a corner OF spot. While it's nice to only spend cash, and keep players, when signing a free agent, you have to look at the other costs. Are you trading for a guy with only a couple years left on a deal who won't kill you financially down the road? Are you trading for a guy from a team that would be willing to take back some garbage like Rusch or Neifi that is already killing you? There's a lot more to look at than just, he's the biggest name corner OF free agent, let's get him. I just look at CLee as a good option then you can use the players you would trade to fill left to fill some other hole and there plenty of holes to fill. Carlos Lee will be a hugely overpaid player who won't produce like he's paid. We've been down this road before. That written, it wouldn't shock me one bit to see the Cubs sign him. They like guys who can hit their pitching; trouble is once they come to the Cubs they aren't hitting against the Cubs any longer.

This is like a freaking recurring nightmare that won't end. They are killing my love for the Cubs. Killing it.

No, it's not. And it's not even close. It's just shortsided stupidity. Rooting or not rooting for the Cubs has no bearing on what they will do now or in the future. While I understand your point about how rooting for or against the Cubs doesn't affect their performance one way or the other, I do not understand why you state that rooting for them to lose right now is "shortsided [sic] stupidity." In other words, if: a) rooting for or against doesn't make a difference and b) rooting for the team to lose is shortsighted and stupid then c) rooting for the team to win would also be shortsighted and stupid I don't think Soul was arguing that his rooting against the team has tangible short-term benefits. I believe he was simply stating that the continued losing will have tangible long-term benefits. Yeah, what's up with that CubinNY? If the Cubs win and win enough to win a WS somebody is doing somthing right. That probably won't happen with this team any time soon, but that is beside the point. To me it is foolish to root for your favorite team to lose regardless of who is managing, playing or GMing. I don't get it, but that is just me

No, it's not. And it's not even close. It's just shortsided stupidity. Rooting or not rooting for the Cubs has no bearing on what they will do now or in the future.

I always want the Cubs to win. That's why it hurts so much when they lose. I would like nothing more than for Baker to be a genius, Rothschild to be better than Mazzone, and Sarge to be the reincarnation of Walt Rheniak. I have invested too much over the years to wish for anything else.

This says it all: I'd love to see ZZThorn back for a day to defend Baker.

well done BK!

couldn't resist! What's wrong with that? It's a highly likely scenario and I don't see it as a terrible excuse. Good Lord. What's wrong with it? It's another excuse that Dusty is using to defend the team's poor play. There is no excuse for this team to have the record it has, but Dusty will do his best to try and find it.

What?? Lee?? Zambrano??? They are the cornerstones of our team! Why should we trade them? And like someone else already said, We're not like the Marlins or Nationals who need to dump salary and start from scratch with all young guys. Don't forget, not all minor leaguers are ready at the same time. To dump all our players...espescially the core of our team like, Lee and Z would be huge mistake! BTW, sorry if this sounds too harsh! I had to respond as soon as I read the first part of this post. Reading is Fundamental

Do they have the DH? If not and he was batting in the 8 slot, that would make sense. If not, I have no idea why they'd ptich around him.

Post of the month

They have to fire Dusty after this series. This team is DOA.

I predictied this last year. That being said, until the WS start losing more than they win, they won't let him go. I'd bet a lot of money that he won't be with the team two years from today.

Jeez, 4 walks in one game? Have the Cubs released him yet? His stat line so far this young season: .176/.481/.176/.657 That IsoD is Dunnesque. Now if he can just get that slugging up. If he's anything like pops he won't be hitting for much power.

It sort of makes one want to cry.

That is not a brain cramp. With the Cubs, that is a way of life. And he was out by 10+ feet

Stupid, stupid, stupid. Fast Freddie Bynum! :pukel:

For sure Murton hasn't been playing well against righties. But it is hard to get RBI with the OBP the Cubs have. Nevertheless, he's playing much better then the guy next to him and yet he's still at the top of the order grounding out to someone in the infield every AB.