CubinNY

I think he sort of authorized a trade-the only thing that concerns me is that Maddux said if Hendry can find the right players. Basically, I'm wondering if Maddux is willing to be traded for any prospect or if the Cubs need to get something good in return. There are intangibles to keeping Maddux-the idea that he can continue to mentor the pitching staff is one. Two is player loyalty-I think a situation like this could have a minor influence the next time a free agent decides to sign with us, especially if that FA is a veteran. Third is the issue of the casual fan. The casual fan still is upset that Maddux was given away in the first place, and will be very upset if they learn that he was traded away for basically nothing-they don't see how he is now, they see Maddux the HOF still. I think all these intangibles give some benefit to keeping him. Now, if I can get a decent to good prospect, I trade him away. If nobody is willing to give very much, then I take the intangibles and keep him here. If you take the intangibles how do you know what you've have beside a washed up pitcher taking a roster spot? Well, I wouldn't completely classify him as washed up-he is putting up average major league pitcher stats this year. And what do you mean about how do you know what you have? I know that Maddux has been helping the young pitchers, and as Olney said last night (I think he was quoting an NL GM at the time) that Hendry was in a tough spot because it is trading away a legend-which ties into my 2nd and 3rd intangible. Just because I can't measure them doesn't mean they don't exist, and all the other evidence points them to at least making a minor impact. What other evidence? and if there are other evidence does that not make the intangible tangible? Marshall and Marmoll haven't shown that much progress. All the romantic "Maddux is more than the sum of his parts" has an odor. Maddux was good, he no longer is. The Cubs are way out of contention. It's time to get rid of old players who are not good. The Cubs have to look toward the future or they will find themselves in the exact same spot they are in right now. And nobody wants that intangible.

I think he sort of authorized a trade-the only thing that concerns me is that Maddux said if Hendry can find the right players. Basically, I'm wondering if Maddux is willing to be traded for any prospect or if the Cubs need to get something good in return. There are intangibles to keeping Maddux-the idea that he can continue to mentor the pitching staff is one. Two is player loyalty-I think a situation like this could have a minor influence the next time a free agent decides to sign with us, especially if that FA is a veteran. Third is the issue of the casual fan. The casual fan still is upset that Maddux was given away in the first place, and will be very upset if they learn that he was traded away for basically nothing-they don't see how he is now, they see Maddux the HOF still. I think all these intangibles give some benefit to keeping him. Now, if I can get a decent to good prospect, I trade him away. If nobody is willing to give very much, then I take the intangibles and keep him here. If you take the intangibles how do you know what you've have beside a washed up pitcher taking a roster spot?

http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/cubs.asp?id=212002 Too bad he likely played his last game of professional baseball last week.

Minaya is not that foolish. I think theyll give us Xavier Nady Let's throw Maddux, Cedeno, and someone else at them for Reyes. That someone else would have to be Zambrano.

Miledge could already be in Cubbie blue if the Cubs would have drafted him instead of Harvey. :x

I would guess that it curtails any concerns a GM might have that Maddux has lost it. Someone like Omar Minaya is probably taking a hard look at the situation. It seems his only option would be to give up Lastings Milledge to get Zito or look to Maddux and give up a lesser prospect or two depending on the deal. Victor Diaz for Maddux

Todd Walker would be a good match for NY as Cano is down with a hamstring injury. I don't know what the Cubs could get for him though. Maddux would get eaten alive in the AL.

the answer: hendry is convinced that the cubs' problems this year were a direct result of injuries and injuries alone. he is prepared to bring back 7 of 8 positional starters next season (and more than likely prepared to allow dusty to start neifi at second a minimum of 100 times). although i could see him overpaying for soriano, who, when allowed to swing as he likes with clines returning as the batting coach, will have a large dip in OPS. expect no major changes, i'm afraid. hendry is married to this team: if it fails, he will perceive his philosophy as one of failure. he's not ready to do that yet. I so agree. Damn injures have killed the Cubs, not.

Ozzie Smith definitely belongs in the Hall of Fame. No doubt he reinvented the position... Not on your life. If Ozzy played today, he wouldn't even start for most teams.

Interesting indeed! Well as other poster said we needed give Hill the lead so he can relax. Well the cubs did and the next inning Hill gave it back. So much for that theory... What a mornic post. But one of many unfortunately. I so wish NSBB was around when Maddux or Grace were breaking in the bigs. Not everyone is Lirano.

Get tough Rich.

Not sure if that's sarcasm or not, but I'm excited about this series. I don't care how crappy the Cubs are, a Cubs Cards series always gets the adrenaline going for me. No it's not sarcasm at all. I am fired up. I am really rooting hard for Rich Hill. I really don't care about the score all that much as long as Hill has control, I'l be happy. The rest of the series, not so much. I'd love nothing more than a rotation of: Hill Marmoll Marshall Z Guzman for the rest of the season.

I don't know about anyone else but I am fired up for the game tonight.

What's a "props"

My presesason pics still look pretty good East- NY Mets Centeral- St. Louis Cardinals West- SF Giants WC- Cin Reds (although I originally picked Milwaukee) East- Boston Red Sox Central- Minnesota (although I think the Tigers will win it) West- Oakland A's WC - NY Yankees Playoffs St Louis (Although I originally picked Milwaukee) Oakland A's (see below) WS Oakland A's (although I think Boston will win it all)

http://www.northsidebaseball.com/PremiumForum/viewtopic.php?t=34085&start=0

How about Wilmer Valderrama? :jocolor:

I'd much rather like to believe the former rather than the latter. If so, I applaud Harold for standing up for his belifes. I haven't watched BBTN since they hired Kruck. I wish they would make the show like the NFL match up show they do with Hodge, Colberg, and Jawarski. Talk about great analysis. Instead they do 12 minutes of Yankees, Boston, webgems, touch em all, then on to sportscenter. That show has as much depth as a shot glass.

That's why we don't want Aramis hustlying too much. He's not fast.

Just look at Aramis jog around the bases, he doesn't care.

I would kill for the Cubs to have a young promising team like the Marlins or D-Rays.

Baker doesn't just sit Walker vs LHP he can't handle. He's unjustifiably sat him on numerous occasions. Like the times when Maddux pitches. You gotta have Neifi's glove in there. Nevermid that Maddux has a 5+ ERA and they need all the extra help they can get.

Or in Aramis' case, he seems to have a bad day 75% of the time. He looks bad doing it. Losing looks bad in itself, loosing and not putting for the appropriate effort looks even worse. Thanks for classifying the discussion as juvenile, silly, and pointless. Didn't know you were the authority on that. Agree or disagree, and stats the reasoning. Its silly, juvenile, and pointless to tell someone their argument is the same. It's not an discussion, it's some silly rah, rah, go team knute Rockney crap. Aramis has what, 8 HRs in the last week? How many errors has he made? Maybe he still not 100% in the groin/hamstring/calf region? Hell, I have no idea. He's not fast, I'd rather have him play it conservative on the bases.

This entire debate is silly, juvenile, and pointless. Everybody has a bad day, or doesn't seem to give 100% effort at all times. The difference is that most people don't have television cameras on them at work. Bruno, if you're posting at work you better stop and get a hold of your attitude and desire for your work. The person paying your check might not like it.

Wait a sec. now? The job was his to win in ST and both Guzman and Marshall out pitched him. So lets not here the Cubs don't give Rich Hill many chances. It's not how many chances you are given. It's how you take advantage of those chances when you are given them.. So that's why I haven't won the lottery. Hill hasn't been given a chance. The worst thing is, I believe he still won't be given a chance. He'll get 3 maybe 4 starts and that's if he is good in his first one. Then when Marshall comes back he'll be moved to the bullpen or sent back to AAA. He's been given a decent chance and hasn't shown the ability to pitch at the ML level. Marshall has definately outpitched Hill this year and has earned his spot in the rotation. In Hill's four starts this year he has given up 5, 5, 3, 7 ER respectively. In Marshall's first four starts this year he gave up 4, 4, 2, 0 ER respectively. Marshall showed progress. Hill didn't. He shouldn't get more than 3 or 4 starts to show he can pitch at the ML level. If he has four outings like he did earlier in the year, he shouldn't be given many more. Now, on the other hand, if Hill shows progress, then keep him in the rotation. Marshall has been terrible since then, so I guess he hasn't really shown that much prorgress overall. http://www.fangraphs.com/graphs.aspx?playerid=5905&position=P&page=0&type=full Just goes to show one, that four starts don't a career make. You should see a doctor for your myopia. Yeah, Marshall was terrible on May 1, May 6, May 17, May 27, June 2, June 7, and July 5. I realize that he hasn't been great recently, but if Marshall has been "terrible", how would you classify Hill? That's not the point is it? By your post Marshall grabbing the brass ring when given a chance. Well guess what, he dropped it a long time ago yet he's still been thrown out there. Meanwhile we all know the story with Hill. Even still, he hasn't been given a chance and has been heavily criticized by the big league manager and GM. On top of that, he STILL wouldn't be up if not for an injury.