David

Is it really cheating when the act itself gives the player no actual competitive advantage? I guess the intent is there. If Sammy took a lucky rabbit's foot and put it in his pocket because he thought it would help him, and lucky rabbit feet in pockets were deemed illegal in MLB ages ago because rabbit feet were, at the time, believed to help, would THAT be cheating? If a tree falls in a forest, but nobody's around to hear it, does it make a sound?

It's funny how Mark Grace, who did have a messy divorce from the Cubs and was as slow as molasses around the bases, was never similarly thrown under the bus.

Pie would really have to suck for Payton to be a viable fall back plan. PECOTA projects an OPS for .697 for Payton. I just have a really bad feeling Pie's not going to hit. I think it is important to have realistic expectations of how he'll preform. I think it is realistic to expect a league average CF production from Pie with well above league average fielding. To me the problem is not putting Pie in CF it is that the Cubs don't have a strong enough team to let a talented young CF learn to be a major league player. They need Pie to produce. IF we had a legit SS, we'd be able to handle it pretty well, since we're pretty strong in the other 6 spots in the lineup. If we do get Roberts, probably the best case scenario would be for Theriot to get hurt or suck REALLY bad so that they're stuck having no choice but to give DeRosa a good amount of time at SS. I'm not saying I'd hope for Theriot to start out poorly or get hurt. I'm just saying, realistically, it's probably the best thing that could happen. Why wouldn't the best thing for the Cubs to have Theriot play like he did for that one month, for 3/4 of the season (no one will play like that all season). Then slot him in at the #2 spot and he would be fine. I also find it hard to believe it that the Cubs are not good enough to allow a young CF'er to develop. If the Cubs aren't good enough then who is, maybe the Tigers and Boston. Lee, Ramierez, Soriano are all above average. Fukudome should be above average. Second is average, or will be above average. Soto should be at least an avg. hitting catcher. So that leaves short most likely below avg. at a position that history shows as not impact bat position. So if they can't help bring up a young player, then who can? I said realistically.

Although I agree with the rest of your post, I have to say, "Ugh," to the bolded.

Pie would really have to suck for Payton to be a viable fall back plan. PECOTA projects an OPS for .697 for Payton. I just have a really bad feeling Pie's not going to hit. I think it is important to have realistic expectations of how he'll preform. I think it is realistic to expect a league average CF production from Pie with well above league average fielding. To me the problem is not putting Pie in CF it is that the Cubs don't have a strong enough team to let a talented young CF learn to be a major league player. They need Pie to produce. IF we had a legit SS, we'd be able to handle it pretty well, since we're pretty strong in the other 6 spots in the lineup. If we do get Roberts, probably the best case scenario would be for Theriot to get hurt or suck REALLY bad so that they're stuck having no choice but to give DeRosa a good amount of time at SS. I'm not saying I'd hope for Theriot to start out poorly or get hurt. I'm just saying, realistically, it's probably the best thing that could happen.

The Tribune continues to drag his name through the mud for leaving a completely meaningless game early. They can soapdrop the hell off.

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/ Take a look at the pictures of guys who "dogged" it for Chicago. I'm actually disgusted, for once. Crap like this doesn't usually even get to me. It is such a joke to include him in there with the rest of those guys.

Wow I completely forgot about Dusty batting Neifi 2nd... Do you remember him hitting Rey RNez at the top?

In a tie game in extra innings in the National League Championship series, no less.

I don't really agree with that. If Gallagher is on the team, I think he'll have a legit opportunity to start ahead of Dempster/Lieber/Marquis (if he's on the team). We all know how Lou feels about Marquis, and I doubt he feels much better about Dempster starting.

A - I still don't understand why people attribute a group of posters' opinions to the entire board. The people who were all over the Theriot bandwagon aren't necessarily the same people who want a replacement now. B - Theriot was an upgrade at the time because the alternative was Cesar Izturis. Of course, most of us wanted him to play over Crapturis. C - Theriot is the worst player in our projected every day lineup. It's that simple. I invite you to challenge that. The only player you could possibly cite as worse is Pie, and I guess that all depends on how highly you value him and what you think of minor league numbers.

With the exception of Blanco, that looks like a pretty good bench of young and/or cheap players to me.

If/when I hear that Prior is throwing in the mid-90's again, then I will :cry: ... Otherwise, meh. The high-80's Prior was good at throwing BP.

With the rotation the Cubs had in 2003 they were set for multiple playoff runs in the near future with a monkey at the helm. You wouldn't find many at the time who would disagree. Maybe not that year, but soon. It would've taken a little luck and a crappy division to do it as soon as they did it, which they got, but Dusty had nothing to do with that team accomplishing what it did.

It's too bad we can't just trade, say, Pie+ for Greene (yea, I know, the ten millionth Green proposal), move Soriano to CF (where his bat is far more valuable), and start Murton in LF. Go to war with this team... C - Soto 1B - Lee 2B - DeRosa 3B - Ramirez SS - Greene LF - Murton CF - Soriano RF - Fukudome SP - Z, Lilly, Hill, Gallagher, Marquis RP - Wood, Howry, Marmol, Wuertz, Eyre, and whoever else...

I was wondering the same thing. As was I.

I'm aware it wouldn't have worked, but wasn't that your original suggestion? Maybe you said Cedeno too... We couldn't have matched Seattle's package either. Adam Jones is a better valued prospect than Pie, the Cubs don't have any reliever with the value of Sherrill besides Marmol (C'mon, Ohman??), and don't have anyone with the ceiling/probability of Tillman though we could have matched Butler with say a Veal or even Ceda. We don't have the equivalent. Huseby unfortunately doesn't have very much value right now and though Tillman is very young and raw himself, he does. It doesn't help when Tillman is already gracing Top 50 prospect lists... As far as I know, Meph has always advocated a Pie + filler swap for Greene, but maybe there was another proposal he came up with.

I'm late as hell to this thread, but I'm surprised more people aren't excited about Citi. I can't wait till we never have to watch the Cubs play in that dump known as Shea Stadium, and I've never even been there. It even sucks on TV. Minnesota is probably next on the list, though the Metrodome doesn't bug me as much since the Twins are in the AL.

Looks like a done deal... http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7777230/After-long-process,-M's-finally-nab-Bedard

I appreciate the mention, but you might want to credit RammyFanny (I think) with bringing the OH stuff over here. I do think it's cool of him to pass the stuff on to us, even if half the responses will be some sort of flames.

How can you miss Gallagher when he has only pitched 14 innings? In those 14 innings he has given up 19 hits and 14 ER to go along with 12 walks. Not that Marshalls track recored is very good, I would certainly prefer to trade Gallagher over Marshall at this point, especially if it nets us B. Roberts. Its just great to know that Sean still has all his haters out there and to be honest he was put into a role that he wasn't familiar with. Thats okay everybody is entitled to their opinion, is that to say that with given a chance to start he won't be better? Who knows will that chance be with the Cubs?, who knows and at this point to keep viewing a post that has dragged on for almost 200 pages. Is this trade really going to happen? I don't know at this point and have stopped worrying about it. I like the rest of you will just have to wait and see. I'm sure it would be exciting for you if it did, though, right? You'd have to think Sean has a better chance to pitch and stick in a major league rotation in Baltimore. It's not gonna do much for his W-L record, though. :? Wish they could find a way to do the deal without Sean. I'd almost rather keep him than Pie.

How can you miss Gallagher when he has only pitched 14 innings? In those 14 innings he has given up 19 hits and 14 ER to go along with 12 walks. Not that Marshalls track recored is very good, I would certainly prefer to trade Gallagher over Marshall at this point, especially if it nets us B. Roberts. Great logic. Let's completely ignore their ages minor league track records and fixate on 14 innings of limited major league usage. Oh, and welcome to the forum! :D

I'm not sure which will happen first...the Bedard trade becoming official, or me figuring out if all of your winking means something. I'm still trying to figure out what he means with the quotes around Bedard's name. :shock:

Thanks... and so am I... have been for weeks.

CC, I actually had a question. Probably doesn't belong here, but this thread has plenty of random crap, anyway. What was the name of that sushi joint that you said shared the same owner as Bob San? I was hoping to check it out this weekend.