Transmogrified Tiger

Vargas looks like a good prospect, a lot of early success in the big leagues at age 22.

Cleveland has a good, deep pen, and Riske will be too expensive for their low budget. They get pretty decent return for a middle relief/setup guy. Also, Wagner would be the closer in the situation Hoops outlined. I dont know much about there pen but at $2.5M he's not an albertross. They could do much better than wellymeyer and mitre. To be honest i think todd sucks. Sure he throws hard but his offspeed pitch isnt good and his control still needs work. If you look at his as an outsider like cleveland what is so special about him. So when do you trade for Riske? After you sign Wagner? By that time if you miss out on billy you got Riske as your closer and its too late (post dec 15, or whatever that date is) to resign Dempster. Its safer and easier to go with Dempster than Riske. Even if Riske is an upgrade over Dempster it aint by much. Resign Dempster, go after Billy, if that fals through then go after Riske. Cleveland can't afford to pay their non-closer 2.5 million, they're in a pretty tight financial bind. For a middle reliever/setup man, I'd say that we're borderline overpaying for Riske.

A) What progress has this organization made? The big league team has fallen drastically since 2003, the minor leagues are nowhere near what they were like in the late 90's early 00's. B) Why does a youth movement equate to giving up a season? I am so sick of the attitude that you can't win with youth. Atlanta is doing it right now. Oakland has done it time and time again. C) This front office has shown absolutely no ability to capitalize on their ability to outspend most other teams, wasting money on mediocre replacable veterans. I'm not one to celebrate mediocrity, but I'd like not to regress back to the pre-2003 performance and expectations. Playing youth doesn't mean losing or giving up, but going full out with one certainly hurts your chances. Cedeno, Murton, and Pie are really the only viable starting prospects we have. Pie isn't ready, Murton may not hit for enough power to be a corner OF, and Cedeno looks like he'll be a decent SS. Greenberg, Fontenot, maybe Frese/Bacon could be good reserves, but having them in conjunction with the above in the lineup would be a disaster. You know I'm not about paying mediocre veterans, but at the same time, people are suggesting Lee/Fontenot/Cedeno/Ramirez/Murton/Patterson/Pie as our lineup, that's going to lose a ton of games for us. I have no problem with playing youngsters, and as you probably know I prefer them in a matchup of similar talents, but going young for the sake of going young doesn't improve the team.

Also of note, even his typically bad numbers against LHP from previous years are better than Neifi's over that same time.

Catcher ERA is a very unreliable tool to measure a catcher's effectiveness. Barrett's been one of if not the top offensive catcher in the NL. We'd be hard pressed to find a better one, and he's signed to a pretty long-term, yet very reasonable contract.

Cleveland has a good, deep pen, and Riske will be too expensive for their low budget. They get pretty decent return for a middle relief/setup guy. Also, Wagner would be the closer in the situation Hoops outlined.

Woohoo, more bench time for Walker so Neifi can play!

Why are so many people essentially throwing away 2006 by suggesting a youth movement? The Cubs don't have that many positional prospects that are good enough to plug in, but they do have a solid farm system and a high payroll that they can revamp the team for success in 2006 and the long-term. Now, there might be doubts that this management can effectively do that, but essentially giving up on the progress the organization has made seems wrong to me.

I really like the idea of acquiring Riske. I've never been a huge Zito fan, but I guess I won't weep if the price is right. Wouldn't Millwood be a similar addition with no player cost? Trading for Zito also has the possibility of being a rental. EDIT to add: I really really really really really don't like the idea of Pie on the Cubs roster, never mind starting and hitting 8th next year.

AB R H 2B 3B HR TB RBI BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS Simon 103 13 29 3 0 6 50 21 4 7 0.282 0.318 0.485 0.804 Karros 336 37 96 16 1 12 150 40 28 46 0.286 0.340 0.446 0.786 Choi 202 31 44 17 0 8 85 28 36 49 0.218 0.350 0.421 0.771 Choi v. RHP: .232/.349/.449/.798 Karros v. RHP: .246/.286/.397/.683

Choi tanked before the injury. I think the vast majority of players in the game go through a stretch where they hit .200/minimal run production over 50 ab during the course of a 600 ab, 162 game season. Indeed. By they way... has Choi extracated himself from that tank yet ?? .809 OPS this year, still far better than Eric Karros against RH. wow. all-star material. Again, Choi was always a better option against righties than Karros, but Dusty wouldn't give him consistent time against them after the injury. Then they went and got Simon and there was no problem giving him starts v. RHP.

Ronnie went to auburn.. He plays for Miami, so I guess that counts.

Choi tanked before the injury. I think the vast majority of players in the game go through a stretch where they hit .200/minimal run production over 50 ab during the course of a 600 ab, 162 game season. Indeed. By they way... has Choi extracated himself from that tank yet ?? .809 OPS this year, still far better than Eric Karros against RH.

Nolasco!

It's exactly the point. Baker refuses to play the young players even when they are as good or better options than the alternatives. I agree about the organizational focus, I was talking about the topic of the thread, Dusty and his tendencies with young players.

That depends on who you compare them to. Compared to Karros, Lenny Harris, Jose Hernandez, and 2005 Hollandsworth they look pretty good.

Away from Billy Wagner. How come CPatt? NM, don't know what I was looking at hehe, 24 mill seems high. The 3 in conjunction with the 24 is the important part. Remember Remmy. That has a nice ring to it. I think he's worth it...dude is only 34...hasn't had an ERA above 2.5 in 4 years...last three I think the average is under 2.0... Is he the only thing we need? not by a long shot....but he makes it an 8 inning game. Heck...Matt Lawton is getting 7.75 Mill... For Comparision...Rivera is getting 10.5 Mill, Izzy is 8.2, Foulke is getting 7.5, .... 8 for Wagner doesn't seem out of line at all....heck, maybe we could say we couldn't afford Neifi because of the expense. Look at Remmy's numbers the 3-4 years before we signed him. Age will catch up to Wagner too, especially since he relies on that little body to throw heat.

It is the Transactions forum. It's not like off-season threads are bumping current transaction threads to obscurity.

Away from Billy Wagner. How come CPatt? NM, don't know what I was looking at hehe, 24 mill seems high. The 3 in conjunction with the 24 is the important part. Remember Remmy. That has a nice ring to it.

Ricky Nolasco, anyone? 1.24 WHIP 9.68 K/9 4/1 K/BB In AA at age 22, the same age as Patterson(who's in low A), 2 years younger than Sing, 3 years younger than Hill. Cedeno is a good choice too.

Away from Billy Wagner.

Edmonds' overall production (specifically his OPS) is WAY below anything he's done in the previous 5 years, so I think it's fair to say he's underachieving. I think that the point with Marquis is that you would EXPECT a pitcher with his ability would begin to get progressively better at age 27, rather than take a step backward, which he's done. If you think a player has to get progressively better at 27, then you have to expect a 35 year old to decline. Most 35 year olds don't play to their career averages, never mind slightly above them.

They certainly will. My point was that, even with a "statistical correction", he's a very, very good player. His '04 season was actually his worst since '01; it just doesn't look like it, due to ballpark effects. Plus, I'm of the opinion that he's actually turned the corner, and isn't likely to regress TOO much. His approach at the plate is much better. His strikeouts are way down from previous, he's taking more walks again (though not as many as in '02-'03 -- stupid Cubs philosophy!), and, most important of all, he hasn't had a bad month, which always was a problem in the past. In fact, his worst OPS for a single month this year is July's 1.048. Based on this, while I doubt he'll have another year as good as this, whatever adjustments he's made have helped both his pitch recognition and his consistency. Those things are likely to help him continue at a higher level than as in previous seasons to this one, IMO. Lee may not regress back to his career norms, but I still have my doubts about him being a 1.000 OPS guy in coming years. With all the talent at 1B, it might be better served not to extend Derrek, and even capitalize on his inflated value by trading him. Also, and I'd expect you'd already know this, Derrek's had a great string of luck this year, BABIP-wise. Without his good fortune, Lee's OPS goes down a minimum of 60 points.

I don't think it's feasible to be able to sign all 3 of Damon, Giles, and Ryan. Pie needs time at AAA, I wouldn't even consider him an option for the big league club until the ASB at the least(although you did list Murton as an alternative). Damon won't be worth the contract that he'll command. His splits away from Fenway are Lawton-esque, he's 31 years old, and he wants 4/40. Who do you have in mind to acquire as a SP? and if you plan on getting all 3 big FA's, how are you going to afford to acquire a quality SP?

This thing is over 20 years old. It's an almost surefire bet to win for the person not drinking the milk. I once saw a competition where they had 5 guys trying it at once. I think 2 threw up, and 2 quit near the end after the winner finished his.