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For everyone calling that lucky, weren't we UNLUCKY with the kick off the 1st base bag? :roll: WTG Dempster, great pitch, great turn, way to cover 1st. Lou was pumped up!

So are umps that don't call strikes.

Hitting a baseball fair is tough and doing it only 33% of the time is excellent?

:lol: Jock can't walk here can he?

I think some of you are too spoiled by Lee's defense. I know the fact that I got irritated by his missed scoop means I am.

I hope you're not implying that last batter was Demps fault. No, but that one most definitely was. I edited my post immediately. :evil:

Good perspective as always.

but that one was. :evil:

This is untrue. If I am Pedro Martinez and it's the offseason between 1999 and 2000, and I say I predict I will win the CYA, does that make me an idiot or arrogant? That makes me betting on the odds. But this is a tangent but there are a few cases where predicting a CYA for yourself isn't idiotic. I don't have a problem with that comment. It came off wrong, but it seemed to me like that was his goal. Frankly, I'd rather his goal be to win the CYA than make the playoffs, because of he does the first the second would come. No, because Pedro usually backs it up. And so does Z. Until 3 months out of this year. Z's never had Cy Young stuff. Pedro did. Sure he has. He has some of the best stuff in all of baseball. Not as good as Pedro in his prime. Pedro in his prime is the SOLE comparison for Cy Young talent?

It's not as if this was his first bad start in a month or two, this is his fifth bad start in a row Not to mention that he's been bad more than he's been good this year. SO WHAT? He's been good for 4 freaking years. 5 bad starts and you turn on a guy. Yep that exhibits class.

Ok a very bad year for my standards on Carlos Zambrano. Maybe standards that don't allow a pitcher (even an ace) to have a bad year are unrealistic? True, but his numbers have been declining for three years now. Then Dusty Baker should be booed. No one has been abused like Carlos, especially when he was young.

Ok a very bad year for my standards on Carlos Zambrano. Maybe standards that don't allow a pitcher (even an ace) to have a bad year are unrealistic?

This is untrue. If I am Pedro Martinez and it's the offseason between 1999 and 2000, and I say I predict I will win the CYA, does that make me an idiot or arrogant? That makes me betting on the odds. But this is a tangent but there are a few cases where predicting a CYA for yourself isn't idiotic. I don't have a problem with that comment. It came off wrong, but it seemed to me like that was his goal. Frankly, I'd rather his goal be to win the CYA than make the playoffs, because of he does the first the second would come. No, because Pedro usually backs it up. And so does Z. Until 3 months out of this year. How many Cy Young's does Z have? So now we're judging pitchers based on awards? I suppose only those that get gold gloves back up their defensive talk with actual defense?

This is untrue. If I am Pedro Martinez and it's the offseason between 1999 and 2000, and I say I predict I will win the CYA, does that make me an idiot or arrogant? That makes me betting on the odds. But this is a tangent but there are a few cases where predicting a CYA for yourself isn't idiotic. I don't have a problem with that comment. It came off wrong, but it seemed to me like that was his goal. Frankly, I'd rather his goal be to win the CYA than make the playoffs, because of he does the first the second would come. No, because Pedro usually backs it up. And so does Z. Until 3 months out of this year.

This statement is unequivocally false.

Much like the fans at wrigley and those who advocate booing. Show me one athlete that has reached this level without arrogance? You have to be arrogant to reach the professional ranks. Not all of them show it. And the Cy Young stuff is just Z being Z.

So we are villifying him by wanting him to stop sucking and start pitching like the ace he is? Ya sounds like we are real irrational. you've been villifying him from your very first post. And no one said anything about the fact that wanting him to stop sucking is a bad thing. But that yesterday was beyond that. We are going to have to agree to disagree because you arent going to change my mind that there was nothing wrong with what took place yesterday from the fans. I was just about to say the same thing, because I think yesterday was bushleague and classless. So was his performence... hahahahaha. that's a good one. yea z's all out hustle and zeal and passion for which he plays the game is the complete opposite of bushleague and classless. But I know you need to feel justification for the way he was treated by supposed fans yesterday. I don't care about hustle, Zeal, and Passion. I care about results, and the man isn't getting it done when we need him most. It's really that simple. As someone who has played competitive sports through college, there are a few things players directly control. You can work hard, you can want it badly, you can practice and dedicate yourself to a trade, but when you hit the field, you can't control what opponents do. I expect the best effort and committment to winning from my players. Seomteimes you just don't have good stuff and there isn't anything you can do it about. It is these situations in which I feel players need support not villification.l More times then not it's not about Z having good stuff. It's about him losing his concentration and composure on the mound. Then booing him would be even MORE counterproductive. It would rattle him even more. Put it this way. If this rattles him, I would hate to see him in the World Series. Like someone else said early, I think Z saw the fans almost like his teammates. He wanted nothing more than to stay in Chicago, and he took a paycut to do so (Mets, yanks, Bo Sox would have given him more money for sure). So what happened yesterday was sobering for him. Maybe he won't be disillusioned anymore I guess. I don't think pressure rattles him, I think he felt betrayed by "family".

So we are villifying him by wanting him to stop sucking and start pitching like the ace he is? Ya sounds like we are real irrational. you've been villifying him from your very first post. And no one said anything about the fact that wanting him to stop sucking is a bad thing. But that yesterday was beyond that. We are going to have to agree to disagree because you arent going to change my mind that there was nothing wrong with what took place yesterday from the fans. I was just about to say the same thing, because I think yesterday was bushleague and classless. So was his performence... hahahahaha. that's a good one. yea z's all out hustle and zeal and passion for which he plays the game is the complete opposite of bushleague and classless. But I know you need to feel justification for the way he was treated by supposed fans yesterday. I don't care about hustle, Zeal, and Passion. I care about results, and the man isn't getting it done when we need him most. It's really that simple. As someone who has played competitive sports through college, there are a few things players directly control. You can work hard, you can want it badly, you can practice and dedicate yourself to a trade, but when you hit the field, you can't control what opponents do. I expect the best effort and committment to winning from my players. Seomteimes you just don't have good stuff and there isn't anything you can do it about. It is these situations in which I feel players need support not villification.l More times then not it's not about Z having good stuff. It's about him losing his concentration and composure on the mound. Then booing him would be even MORE counterproductive. It would rattle him even more.

Holy jesus the irony is frightening.

No one is arguing over whether they have the right to boo. Clearly they do.

So we are villifying him by wanting him to stop sucking and start pitching like the ace he is? Ya sounds like we are real irrational. you've been villifying him from your very first post. And no one said anything about the fact that wanting him to stop sucking is a bad thing. But that yesterday was beyond that. We are going to have to agree to disagree because you arent going to change my mind that there was nothing wrong with what took place yesterday from the fans. I was just about to say the same thing, because I think yesterday was bushleague and classless. So was his performence... hahahahaha. that's a good one. yea z's all out hustle and zeal and passion for which he plays the game is the complete opposite of bushleague and classless. But I know you need to feel justification for the way he was treated by supposed fans yesterday. I don't care about hustle, Zeal, and Passion. I care about results, and the man isn't getting it done when we need him most. It's really that simple. As someone who has played competitive sports through college, there are a few things players directly control. You can work hard, you can want it badly, you can practice and dedicate yourself to a trade, but when you hit the field, you can't control what opponents do. I expect the best effort and committment to winning from my players. Seomteimes you just don't have good stuff and there isn't anything you can do it about. It is these situations in which I feel players need support not villification.l

So we are villifying him by wanting him to stop sucking and start pitching like the ace he is? Ya sounds like we are real irrational. you've been villifying him from your very first post. And no one said anything about the fact that wanting him to stop sucking is a bad thing. But that yesterday was beyond that. We are going to have to agree to disagree because you arent going to change my mind that there was nothing wrong with what took place yesterday from the fans. I was just about to say the same thing, because I think yesterday was bushleague and classless. So was his performence... hahahahaha. that's a good one. yea z's all out hustle and zeal and passion for which he plays the game is the complete opposite of bushleague and classless. But I know you need to feel justification for the way he was treated by supposed fans yesterday.

So we are villifying him by wanting him to stop sucking and start pitching like the ace he is? Ya sounds like we are real irrational. you've been villifying him from your very first post. And no one said anything about the fact that wanting him to stop sucking is a bad thing. But that yesterday was beyond that. We are going to have to agree to disagree because you arent going to change my mind that there was nothing wrong with what took place yesterday from the fans. I was just about to say the same thing, because I think yesterday was bushleague and classless.

So we are villifying him by wanting him to stop sucking and start pitching like the ace he is? Ya sounds like we are real irrational. you've been villifying him from your very first post. And no one said anything about the fact that wanting him to stop sucking is a bad thing. But that yesterday was beyond that.

Yea I know its just all us ignorant Cub fans. If Carpenter had pitched like this down the stretch immediatly after becoming the highest paid pitcher in baseball on an average basis, and then made an ignorant comment about the fans, the greatest fans in baseball would just keep loving away, and not boo or say a word. Yea thats it..... I'd bet my bank account Cards fans wouldn't boo Carpenter after 5 bad starts. It's not 5 bad starts. He's been bad for 4 months. How much is in your account? Yea those starts in June and July were awful. good one.