XZero771679666304

There's some reason to believe they do see it. The rumors have been there that they've shopped Kosuke and that a poor showing against the Reds will lead to a fire sale. Hendry's a patient trader and generally pretty good at it. No sense in rushing to move players when waiting a bit might increase the return (or raise interest in some guys who have none now). We've still got 29 days until the trading deadline, might as well use them to maximize players' value. Frankly I'm tired of wanting the Cubs to lose, but I still fear desperation moves. The sooner this thing gets blown up, the sooner we can move on and start thinking positively about next year and beyond. If we lose this series to the Reds (better yet a sweep), the towel has to be realistically thrown in. Offering Kosuke isn't reassuring. Offering Lee, Lilly and Silva would be a good start on the offseason. I really think the Cubs can contend next season, but only if the rest of this season is played shrewdly.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5343153 terrible http://www.filmofilia.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/hot_tub_time_machine_01-535x356.jpg Nothing if not predictable. On a related note, as I was hitting the quote button a commercial for Hot Tub Time Machine came on.

Probably as part of some sort of delayed initiation.

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument. Start a 26 page thread about how much Aramis Ramirez has sucked this year and you might be on to something. This team would have been bad anyway, but Lou has been awful on multiple fronts. His lineup construction has been consistently crappy (keeping Lee and Ramirez 3-4 when they were at their coldest while at the same time burying Soriano/Soto in the 6-7-8 when they were smoking hot was just mind numbing, and may have cost the team 2-3 wins right there). His bullpen management has been horrible. He leaves SP in too long. He's just bad. The Hill/Soto thing is almost immaterial compared to the other crap. Yeah, Ramirez and Lee have sucked. But Lou really compounded things by sticking these two auto outs in between the players who actually were hitting,when they were hitting. Remember when Byrd, Kosuke, Soriano and Soto were all OPSing over .900, and the team still wasn't scoring? How many rallies were killed by Ramirez and Lee, or those killed by the pitcher's spot because our two best hitters were batting 6-7? And then there's the Z to the bullpen retardation. Good managers stay out of the way and make the obvious moves. Bad managers exacerbate bad situations by being obstinate or micromanaging. Lou has clearly been the latter this season. Thanks for making my point. If Lee and Ramirez had not sucked all year things would be much different. Hiding what are supposed to be your two best hitters at the bottom of the order is not the answer, them hitting is . I think Lou is an average manager. Replacing him solves very little. Lou has absolutely made a bad situation worse. Do I want him as Cubs manager after this year? Absolutely not. Would firing him a month ago have kept the Cubs in contention, or would firing him now save the season? No way. As long as he and Hendry are gone come October, I'm fine with that. But let's not pretend people are grasping at straws criticizing him. This goes way beyond playing Hill too much - he has become an overall bad manager, making decisions completely contrary to logic. He could have lessened the impact of Lee and Ramirez blowing, but he has maximized it.

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument. Start a 26 page thread about how much Aramis Ramirez has sucked this year and you might be on to something. This team would have been bad anyway, but Lou has been awful on multiple fronts. His lineup construction has been consistently crappy (keeping Lee and Ramirez 3-4 when they were at their coldest while at the same time burying Soriano/Soto in the 6-7-8 when they were smoking hot was just mind numbing, and may have cost the team 2-3 wins right there). His bullpen management has been horrible. He leaves SP in too long. He's just bad. The Hill/Soto thing is almost immaterial compared to the other crap. Yeah, Ramirez and Lee have sucked. But Lou really compounded things by sticking these two auto outs in between the players who actually were hitting,when they were hitting. Remember when Byrd, Kosuke, Soriano and Soto were all OPSing over .900, and the team still wasn't scoring? How many rallies were killed by Ramirez and Lee, or those killed by the pitcher's spot because our two best hitters were batting 6-7? And then there's the Z to the bullpen retardation. Good managers stay out of the way and make the obvious moves. Bad managers exacerbate bad situations by being obstinate or micromanaging. Lou has clearly been the latter this season.

Well, there just isn't enough to pass judgement on them yet. Lou has been awful, but with Lee and Ramirez in the toilet, this thing wasn't going anywhere anyway. If Lou had been fired a month ago, I don't think the team would be in much better shape. It's a lost season, that much has been clear for a while. I'd rather they get their ducks in a row before making changes rather than just chopping heads in a reactionary fashion. If change isn't made immediately after the season, then I'll be concerned. It was always pretty implicit that this season was going to be spent taking stock.

It's the Toyota sign. They're agents of the dark side.

It's stupid. Not only is Z more valuable as a starter, but banishing him to the pen reduces his trade value. It's petty and obtuse on multiple levels, and only works against the best interests of the team. There is no franchise in baseball that will let stupid petty garbage get between them and doing what's best for themselves like the Cubs. This is the third player in six years they've done this with. I suppose they should be counting their lucky stars that the last two times have turned out as well as they have, between getting a moderately useful backup infielder and a miraculous turnaround year out of a pitcher for the players they nuked bridges with. It's Jim Hendry's demonize and devalue problem player movement philosophy. I mean what better way to get the most in return for a player you want gone than to make them look as unappealing as possible while demonstrating your desperation to get rid of them? This situation demonstrates just how inept Hendry is. Z was out of line, but the reaction by management was just about as counterproductive as you could possibly imagine. As were the Sosa and Bradley situations. It's almost as if Hendry likes to challenge himself by sacrificing all his leverage.

It's stupid. Not only is Z more valuable as a starter, but banishing him to the pen reduces his trade value. It's petty and obtuse on multiple levels, and only works against the best interests of the team.

I agree with you Tim, but I still don't think he'll opt out. In this economy, I can't believe he'll get offers of around $40 million over 3 years with his history of injury and his "down" years. If he comes back next year ($14.6 million) and shows that he's healthy, he would be in line to get $16 million in 2012 from the Cubs or a 2-3 year deal from another team. Down years? What, 2002? The injury history is one thing, but this is his first "down" year as a Cub. The man has a .900 OPS every freaking year, which is why this season has been so bizarre. But I agree there's little chance he opts out, unless he posts a 1.200 OPS from here on out.

It's borderline adequate, from what I've seen. The bigger issue with him is whether or not he'd accept a one year deal, and if not, what could be done with him after 2011. I think he'll be able to get a multi-year deal again. Having said that, I would very much approve of using him as a stop gap between Lee and Adrian/Prince/whoever. As for 2011, I think the Cubs can content next year is things are played shrewdly between now and then. And while I think Hendry will be shown the door immediately after the season ends, it's up to him to effectively sell before this years deadline. I know as a lame duck GM that might not seem likely (to many), but it would behoove him to do it to the best of his abilities for his long term employment chances. I would trade Lilly, Lee, Nady, Silva and Theriot before the deadline, for prospect packages. I think Hendry really would like to trade Z, but wonder if Ricketts will allow it. I hope no, since he and Lou are doing their best to drive his trade value down, and the Cubs would take a huge bath in a Z deal. Kosuke may be traded, but I doubt it. Ramirez would have to be a fool to opt out after this season. Given that, my best case, realistic scenario 2011 roster is this: C: Soto 1B: Dunn 2B: Fontenot/Baker SS: Castro 3B: Ramirez LF: Soriano CF: Byrd RF: Fukudome Bench: Castillo, Barney, Baker, Colvin, Snyder Rotation: Dempster, Gorzelanny, Cashner, Jackson, Zambrano/Wells/Marshall Bullpen: Marmol, Stevens, Russell/Gaub/Parker, Grabow, Marshall No, it's not inspiring, to say the least. Pretty similar in the lineup, but utilizing a lot more of the farm instead of nickel and dime contracts for bit players. But in this division, it's capable of contention, provided a decent manager and Ramirez not absolutely sucking again. When Ramirez and Fukudome come off the books, it will open up a few more options. If the Cubs add a premier 1B and allocate resources better, I can see the team being a championship contender a couple years down the road.

How could this possibly make you or anyone else long for the Tribune over the Ricketts this early into the Ricketts' ownership? Yeah, it's silly. The word from the beginning was that the new ownership would assess after this year, and at this point it would be pointless to make any moves other than to tell the GM to sell. People are just discontent because heads aren't rolling, but it wouldn't make a difference right now. Action for the sake of action isn't positive.

I don't really see how this is on Lou. Z is an extremely hot temper as it is and then we compile onto that a team that sucks right now and him struggling quite a bit. It has much more to do with those two things than Lou having lost control of the clubhouse, I think. Oh, believe me, Z is plenty at fault too. But as a rule you generally don't see dugout fights on teams where the manager has control. We've known for quite a while that Lou phoned it in a while ago. This is yet another example. Although I said at the beginning of the year, if we're going to suck, I want us to SUCK. Get those high draft picks next June and get a lot of the dead weight out of here. Maybe this team completely collapsing will be best in the long run. Z going on a tirade has nothing to do with Lou. I don't think Lou has control of the clubhouse, but what happened today is an unrelated issue. It wasn't a fight, it was Z having a tantrum. It wasn't the first time, and it wasn't the first manager.

ooooo. that is interesting And fruitless. We all know it won't happen. My guess is Gorz moving back to the rotation, which is fine with me. Cashner or Jackson may well get the rotation call if/when Wells goes to AAA or the pen. Gorz will replace Z, and it would be nice if Cashner gets Lilly's spot when he is traded.

Hendry won't fire him, and it wouldn't help. What we need is a fire sale. I want both. Hendry's a lame duck GM, though. I don't think an all-out fire sale is coming. If ownership calls for it, I'm not sure he'll have much of a choice, other than to resign. And an all-out fire sale isn't realistic, with some of the contracts the Cubs have. But shipping Lee, Lilly, Silva, Theriot, Nady and maybe Fukudome would be helpful (for next year). Absolutely, I'm all for a complete overhaul. That's really the only thing I'll accept at this point. Nobody knows the Ricketts well enough yet, so I guess we'll just have to wait and see. It's completely obvious that this team is dead in the water, though. There's no resurrection coming here. I don't know how the Sox did it, but just because they somehow overcame their terrible start doesn't mean we are. There's just nothing to really like about this team, outside of the outfield and Marmol. Everyone else can go and I wouldn't shed a tear. That would be nice, but trading Z and Ramirez would be problematic at best, and moving Sori is pretty much impossible. This season is done for sure, but a complete overhaul probably isn't going to happen. Trading the players I named would clear some salary and net a few prospects the new GM could use in the offseason, and I think that's the most we can reasonably expect.

Hendry won't fire him, and it wouldn't help. What we need is a fire sale. I want both. Hendry's a lame duck GM, though. I don't think an all-out fire sale is coming. If ownership calls for it, I'm not sure he'll have much of a choice, other than to resign. And an all-out fire sale isn't realistic, with some of the contracts the Cubs have. But shipping Lee, Lilly, Silva, Theriot, Nady and maybe Fukudome would be helpful (for next year).

Hendry won't fire him, and it wouldn't help. What we need is a fire sale.

No doubt. Hopefully getting embarrassed by the Sox will be the straw that breaks the camel's back. Not that I ever want the Cubs to get embarrassed by the Sox, but it just seems inevitable at this point.

just wait, it's going to be fun I hope so, but I'm tempering my expectations a bit, lol.

Sulley's injecting it into his forehead.

At this point I'm just hoping for a sale to bring in some prospects and maybe a top 10 pick.

mildly nsfw.

I know how you feel, but Lou's not going anywhere, and even if he did, it wouldn't make much of a difference.

I'm not sure how to interpret this

Zambrano may not be a great starter, but you surely can't blame the whole 4th inning on him. He really should have been out of that only down 1-0.