Cubswin11

Gimenez needs to go

Is this good news that nothing was found and he just wants a second opinion to confirm or bad news that he is done until 2020 and wants a second opinion to confirm? I’m just hoping it’s a mental thing to get confirmation he’s not really “hurt” to get over whatever he’s feeling.

Javy and his wife (GF?) had their baby

The idea of Joe Maddon not respecting a player is also hilarious. The guy goes above and beyond what any manager does to sing the praises of his players and shield them from criticism.

I think we found patient zero of the "PLAY ALMORA EVERYDAY" twitter brigade

I think Maddon "respects" him plenty. He's a very nice and useful player and he's fine to leadoff vs LHP but not RHP. He's made strides vs RHP but there's still certain profiles you want to shield him from, he doesn't walk much and he's slow as horsefeathers and he's carrying a really high BABIP this year for a guy who isn't fast. The diving/jumping/running catches in CF are great and all but they also are a product of his slow speed, like yesterday he didn't get to that ball in RCF on Hernandez's ball. He also has never been the picture of health since he's been in the organization, he gets banged up easily and often and needs to be given about as much rest and maintenance as a non-catcher position player needs. If the lineup is at full health he's probably not starting for me vs RHP in the playoffs, tbh. He's a really nice player and does a lot of things well, especially vs LHP and he has a clear role here and I wouldn't really want to move him under many scenarios now or in the offseason.

I would think that too, since Baez can’t be your only real SS option. But Bryant is already plenty fine at 3B and has more value there, give me Bryce damn it.

Don’t trade anyone, sign Bryce. It will work if we can afford it (Zobrist is gone after next year anyways). Schwarber LF (maybe a little Catcher and 1B) Almora CF Happ OF/3B/2B/1B Heyward CF/RF Harper RF/LF Zobrist LF/RF/2B/1B All those guys have platoon numbers to protect/take advantage of and also most have some injury history that a little routine rest and maintenance isn’t the worst of things. LaStella is the odd man out. Harper gives us maximum versatility options (plus he’s just better) since if it’s Machado you’re only going to have one SS in Baez on the roster.

what is the point of this revisionism? you yourself wanted him He's def be on my short list Under the assumption Archer/Stroman aren't available outside of a godfather offer and Gray requires Eloy+ I'm all just for using our money and like Caritini and Jeimer to grab a pitcher who should have elite stuff (at least get the AL to NL bump) and at least fills a rotation spot for a year or 2. I probably wasn't aware of the money/LT hit he had and I wasn't overly against him to begin with. I also assumed we could get him cheaply (Caritni and Jeimer) and also just assumed Q wasn't available to us (who fills the rotation for a year or 2+ and had elite stuff and the AL to NL bump!). And that awesome comment maybe came when he got hot in August because that probably was made in the trade thread to the Astros??? It's funny Sofa and I are on the other end of this now, lol. And I hate myself for ever liking Archer, stupid me. Those comments also didn't have the foresight of seeing how depressed the SP FA market would be. Darvish was in line for a Lester or better deal at the time.

I am almost certain acquiring Verlander would've put us over the LT last year as well if we took on most of his prorated money for the year, his aav is $25.7 so his hit to us last year would've been $12ish million if acquired in August, a little more if in July. We can argue the LT really doesn't matter because the owners can afford it but they operate as if it matters, especially when it comes to repeat offending and the 2019 offseason for Bryce and others. I think we stayed under the 2017 LT threshold by only a few million.

Gretzky is the Javy of hockey, not the other way around

Verlander with the Tigers last year before the trade, fwiw. 28 starts, 3.82 ERA, 4.01 FIP, 4.41 FIP, 9.2 K/9, 3.8 BB/9, 1.2 HR/9, 33% GB rate. The guys wasn’t exactly lights out, the Astros pixies dust got him to another level. But obviously yes knowing the level he went to after the trade I’d gladly pull the trigger for just about any non MLB pieces they wanted at the time or agreed to pay for all his salary (if that was part of it). he was trending the right way approaching the break, and it was well documented that his stuff had been awesome all season, even when he was struggling. you're underselling his attractiveness by just posting those stats. I know we are going to keep arguing in circles, but..... He was a 34 year old pitcher (who we all agree pitchers suck) who was owed ~$70 million yet at the time of the deal for the 2.5 years left on his contract and yeah his August spiked up (6 start sample) but you really want one month to be the reason to trade for that (obviously it worked out but the numbers outside of that and even including it up to that point were just kinda okay). And his July was just meh, 3.82 ERA, 4.43 FIP, 4.61 xFIP, 8.6 K/9, 4 BB/9 so that was his trending up to the deadline, which he wasn't moved. His August he kicked ass but again, we had 20ish starts before that of meh pitching to buy in to it. If you take out his August (again the 6 start sample to sell us) his numbers were 4.29 ERA, 4.15 FIP, 4.81 xFIP, 8.7 K/9, 4.2 BB/9 through July

Verlander with the Tigers last year before the trade, fwiw. 28 starts, 3.82 ERA, 4.01 FIP, 4.41 FIP, 9.2 K/9, 3.8 BB/9, 1.2 HR/9, 33% GB rate. The guys wasn’t exactly lights out, the Astros pixies dust got him to another level. But obviously yes knowing the level he went to after the trade I’d gladly pull the trigger for just about any non MLB pieces they wanted at the time or agreed to pay for all his salary (if that was part of it).

Imo, yes. A 22 year old top 10 pick with position versatility who was a key part of the team at the time for a 34 year old pitcher owed a lot of money yet who relatively recently was kinda not great.

I certainly wouldn’t have minded him for the right cost but wasn’t crazy about him, iirc. And we clearly talked to them since we did Wilson/Avila, maybe there wasn’t a match, maybe the ask was ridiculous like Happ or Schwarber, maybe Theo and fellas didn’t like it (and I’ll give them the benefit), obviously now I’d gladly take him knowing everything we know but that’s hindsight.

The leader and the voice of this board wanted him badly. *Domain Squatter

My question makes perfect sense and you know it. They made the best possible moves with the resources and information they had with the reasonably available guys at the time of need to not only make the playoffs and get a few wins from another WS last year to adding the best possible FAs this year. Yes they’ve been let downs this year but there’s really no realistic alternatives outside of really Monday morning quarterbacking it. Unless you were perfectly fine with punting last year and adding no best option pitchers this offseason and hoping someone else would be available via trade come this deadline. It’s a process vs results thing mostly for me. I’m very fine with the process of the additions but the results have been lacking. i made a post saying i wish we could have a do-over on some whiffs (and yes, i think quintana is a whiff so far), and you're basically saying "oh yeah, what moves did YOU have lined up?". i've said nothing about the process or how the trades appeared at the time. i'm saying i wish they hadn't turned out like this. you have no point. i don't know what you're doing. What’s the do over though? The do over is not making the playoffs last year and holding on to precious Eloy and then doing what? We needed 3 pitchers last year for this year including at least one at the deadline last year for any chance to make the playoffs. We all wish these moves were better to date but we NEEEDED to make 3 moves and I think we made the best moves with what we had to use and what was available. It sucks they haven’t worked but it is what it is and we are still in a great spot if they pitch like they can.

Verlander stings but at the same time we have no idea what they were asking and he was still a 33/34 year old pitcher who was owed over $60 million at the time he was traded I don't think it takes a whole lot of monday morning qb'ing to question that one, though. It probably means they make the Chatwood move, but not the Darvish move. But that still leaves us better off. Clearly they valued Houston's package more. But Detroit's return wasn't a blockbuster we couldn't have competed with. We chose not to match. I think I still would rather do Darvish at 6/120 at 31 YO than Verlander at 2.5/60+ + an option year that vests for another 20+ at 34 YO. If I were asked what I preferred at the time of the Verlander trade last year.

your questions make no horsefeathering sense. I'm not pretending like i know who they should have gotten. I'm saying that having a ton of resources to spend on 2 unknown high-quality long-term pitchers is favorable to having already spent the assets and gotten 2 huge turds. Q was a very good trade, even though we gave up a lot. I was pissed at the time and I'm still pissed that we missed out on Verlander, though. Get Verlander and Q last summer and things could have been different both last fall and this year. Verlander stings but at the same time we have no idea what they were asking and he was still a 33/34 year old pitcher who was owed over $60 million at the time he was traded

Yes. Given who was available at the times we needed to make moves what are the trades or FA signings you’d do? I’m not arguing to date they’ve worked out to what we wished but what are the other moves. We needed 3 starters last year at this time. your questions make no horsefeathering sense. I'm not pretending like i know who they should have gotten. I'm saying that having a ton of resources to spend on 2 unknown high-quality long-term pitchers is favorable to having already spent the assets and gotten 2 huge turds. My question makes perfect sense and you know it. They made the best possible moves with the resources and information they had with the reasonably available guys at the time of need to not only make the playoffs and get a few wins from another WS last year to adding the best possible FAs this year. Yes they’ve been let downs this year but there’s really no realistic alternatives outside of really Monday morning quarterbacking it. Unless you were perfectly fine with punting last year and adding no best option pitchers this offseason and hoping someone else would be available via trade come this deadline. It’s a process vs results thing mostly for me. I’m very fine with the process of the additions but the results have been lacking.

We got to the NLCS last year a good chunk due to Q and I mean what else was there to do this offseason? Legit asking? Do nothing last year and miss the playoffs and then trade Eloy for Cole? We still need two other starters. holy horsefeathers are you serious Yes. Given who was available at the times we needed to make moves what are the trades or FA signings you’d do? I’m not arguing to date they’ve worked out to what we wished but what are the other moves. We needed 3 starters last year at this time.

We got to the NLCS last year a good chunk due to Q and I mean what else was there to do this offseason? Legit asking? Do nothing last year and miss the playoffs and then trade Eloy for Cole? We still need two other starters.

Yu is gonna be fine, he probably was just reading the board lately thinking the season was over and decided to pack it in. Now that we are good he’ll be back.

7 wins would be nice of the next 11. Obviously more would be nice but 7-4 going in would put us in a nice spot. And hopefully Yu isn’t that bad and ready to be back in the next 30 days

:flythew: #WeAreGood