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What were the points? I think the best one is that the Big East beat had one OOC win over a team in the top half of its conference - that being Maryland. Gosh, now I'm watching Lou Holtz on SportsCenter. I swear, his ability to speak is diminishing every passing day. How many does the Big 10/11 have? 2? Wow...that's so much more impressive. How many do the 12 teams in the SEC have? The Big 12? I did a very quick look through the Big 10, and I counted 3 (I counted Notre Dame, I think that's fair)-they beat Texas, Notre Dame, and Pitt. I didn't look through any of the rest.

Hmm-that's interesting. At the same time Sullivan had quotes about Hendry not going to meet with Ramirez's agent next week, Hendry was actually meeting with Ramirez's agent! Not good news to hear that it likely won't get done before Saturday night, though.

Yeah, if they bid that-then good luck to them-I won't be upset at all if the Cubs lose out to a bid like that, because I never would want the Cubs to go quite that high for him.

You can compared him to other free agents. It's just stupid to only compare him to free agents. You have to compare him to everybody. He's makes more than the average players but does not produce more than the average player. Well, then you can compare him to all the players (although the average salary for outfielders overall is still 4.4 million, so Jones is just slightly above average contract) but that means the Cubs cannot sign any second-tier pitchers this year, because they are average and they are going to sign for more than 3.2 million. They will make more than the average starter, but they won't produce more than the average starter also. That is a perfectly valid comparison, since pretty much all of the second-tier pitchers are about the same level to average as Jones. Edit: Excuse me, that's old figures (2002). The starting pitcher number has probably gone up, but the number for right fielders has probably gone up past 5 million now-so Jones is probably average salary at this point.

I like Wuertz, but don't mind giving him up in a deal for a good regular. If you can deal away relievers for everyday difference makers, you have to do it. I just don't like Sheffield in that role. That's the thing-I think Sheffield has the chance to be that, but it's a huge risk. It would all really depend on 1)How Sheffield performs next year and 2)who the Cubs trade/bench to play Sheffield and how much they get for that player.

That's crazy! I understand Cashman is trying to get the best possible deal for Sheffield, but to turn down both The Phillies deal that included Gavin Floyd and a Padres deal that included Scott Linebrink, is beyond insane. Everybody knows that Yankees are trying to trade Sheffield, and everybody knows Sheffield no longer wants to be a Yanks. So to turn down either deal, is beyond idiotic, and I hope they can't trade Sheffield, cause you know Sheffield will tear ANY chemistry that team might have to pieces. What is so crazy about turning down a Gavin Floyd deal? Have you seen his numbers the last two years? He is not the prospect he once was. I know the Yankees turned down this deal with Linebrink, but today Peter Gammons was on Mike and Mike and said that he believes Sheff will end up with the Cubs. The deal would be centered around Wuertz. I had a feeling that's what the deal would be centered around-I really don't know how I feel about that.

Average production at above average cost, not good. And he's just as likely to be below average as above. Jones is only acceptable in RF if they have massive improvements elsewhere. Jones is not above average cost. His contract, by current market, is a bargain. The Cubs are not going to field an all-star at every position, so we agree that assuming upgrades elsewhere, Jones is acceptable. I do find it highly ironic that Hendry got killed for not pursuing Giles on this board, and Jones dwarfed Giles production in 2006, in terms of slugging and OPS. Giles OPS+ 105 Jones OPS+ 107 I find it highly amusing how much you love Jim Hendry screwing up the Cubs. Jones is above average cost. You can't compare him only to free agents, that's absurd. He's not competing only against free agents. Smart teams find ways to get production above cost. Stupid teams spend big on mediocrity. Sure we can compare him to other free agents. When looking at the average pitchers on the market, do teams look at the average value of all the pitchers, or the average market value of that particular pitcher? For example, Miguel Batista. Under your system of comparing him to every pitcher, he should only be worth 1-2 million. On the market, the fair deal is probably around 5. Is it overpaying if somebody gives him 5? Jones was signed below market value for his production last year. If he returns to previous years, then his production will be about market value. He's not a great strength of this team, but he's not a huge weakness either.

Average production at above average cost, not good. And he's just as likely to be below average as above. Jones is only acceptable in RF if they have massive improvements elsewhere. Jones is average production at below average cost in RF (as far as ones who have hit free agency).

Couple of things-Arkansas has to lose twice to get Auburn into the SEC title game. Also, again that wouldn't get much controversy-people would just give Ohio State-Michigan their rematch and claim they were the best 2 teams all along, and everyone else just proved it by losing. I think it would be better for BCS chaos if as many 1 loss teams stayed as possible.

I still think the big difference between Aramis and Lee is that Lee would only have 1 year to prove himself. Lee knew if he got hurt in 2006, then his money might go way down-so he took a deal that would be below his market value (can you imagine if Lee had a good year this year how much his market value would be also?) Aramis knew if he had a bad year, he still had 2 more years at great money to prove himself before FA, and if he had a good year, then he could hit FA now and cash in. It's much, much less of a gamble for Aramis because he makes over 10 million either way-which makes the amount of money needed to get him to agree to an extension much, much more last year.

Agreed. I think so too mainly because the game is in Morgantown. I don't see Rutgers pulling it out on the road. We'll see though. Should be a good game. It's the toughest conference in college football! :wink: The Big East is the only major coference that has each team play each other. Auburn doesn't play Tennessee and Ohio State didn't play Wisconsin. That's very frustrating for me. If Rutgers beats WV, that means they and Ohio State (if they win) will be the only teams that beat 1 loss teams. Yeah, I see Rutgers moving all the way up to #8 thanks to the gurus and their preseason/old boys polls. The Pac 10 also now has every team playing each other.

Am I reading that right? Why would the Cardinals give him a 2/18 to 2/20 deal when they could just give him the 10 million now and see how he does next year? When they said that his average salary is going to be about the same as the option, that just doesn't make much sense to me.

Soriano Zito Schmidt Lee Mats :pukel: I have no idea what this is. It's the board of FA's that the BBTN guys put up on Sportscenter. I wasn't even really paying attention and about 5 times I stopped and thought "hey, what he just said is completely false". That's what I get for not flipping over after the Rutgers-Louisville game. Really? I thought it was actually ok for once. Gammons described Carlos Lee as not a great hitter but not a good, for he has not even hit a 900 OPS once in his career. Schmidt they said with his velocity changing could be a risk. For Daisuke, they described his great stuff, and then said the main concern is his number of IP. Zito, the main thing they talked about was his durability. The only reason they put Soriano above everyone else is his flexibility to play different positions, and his value for many different clubs because of that, along with his physical skills. It was all basic information, but they seemed to cover it pretty well for the uninformed.

I would agree that it would have been very hard to sign Ramirez to a new deal last offseason. Here's the problem. Ramirez knows that if he has a good year, he likely will get 15+ on the open market, and if he has a bad year, he can take the 11+ for the next 2 seasons. Also, he knows that his next contract will be one of his last huge ones-if he signs a 5 year extension after last year, he won't come out of the extension until he's 33. He's not going to take 5/60 under that scenario because he knows with 1 good year he can get more, and even if he doesn't get more then, he has 2 more years at 11 per that he can prove himself again to get more. It would have taken probably 5/70 or more to get him to sign last offseason, and now it probably has gone up to 5/75 or 5/80.

I'm a huge Tyrus fan, but he didn't look good at all when the game was within somewhat of striking distance. Just an all-around bad game. Saturday's game is a huge game for the Bulls before the circus trip. I can't wait for Saturday's game. I'm stuck in TN for the whole year, and this is the first and one of the only times that I'll be able to see the Pacers. They are a much different team from last year-they want to get out and run with half their team different now. They played horribly last night without O'Neal, as he sat out with an ankle sprain-so we'll see how he does, especially after the team plays tomorrow night at home against the Magic. They are 3-2, but I expect them to struggle in the early going of the season as they get used to playing with each other, so my expectations going into a game like the at Chicago game are not high right now. Good luck, and I hope for a great game.

LOL-I was just thinking the same thing about Notre Dame, and it's the same list except of course that USC beats Cal, and Arkansas comes back from losing one of their last 3 games to beat Florida in the SEC title game, and either ND sneaks in front of Auburn or maybe Auburn would lose.

I think Ohio State will win only because I have a hard time seeing Michigan scoring a decent amount of points. It will be very much a defensive game though it looks like, and when it becomes that type of game where 1 play could change the game anybody could win.

I think alot of factors were at work. 1) I heard the Cubs wanted him to take some type of alcohol abuse class, they had a temporary conscious I guess. 2) While there is no salary cap for the Cubs, there is the Tribune budget, a form of the cap. Had Hendry gave Furcal the top dollar maybe he couldn't have filled out the roster with the Neifi Perez's, Rusch's etc. So Hendry see's Furcal's demands and backs off over a few million per season. He then drops nearly 7 million on Rusch/Neifi/Miller. 7 Million. For spots that could have been matched performance wise by players from the minors. Ryan Theirot could have done the job of Perez, any arm from AAA could have done better than Rusch. Hendry is consumed with properly allocated a roster with these role players, etc. I'm assuming he is thinking that Miller will be his "Chris Carpenter" reclamation project. I have an extreme objection to his GM philosophy. IMO, you go out and secure as many top players as possible. Then fill in the gaps from the minors. The problem with that theory about going out and acquiring those role players after failing to get Furcal is that most of that money went to Rusch and Neifi, and they both signed a month before the Furcal situation happened. Hendry had a number for Furcal, and the contract went above that. BTW, as much as it hurt last season, I'm still happy that Furcal wasn't signed for that. He doesn't put big enough numbers-if the team can use that extra money to go out and get an actual star this year, then it will be much more helpful then Furcal for two more years.

Where'd you here that? That's a great contract-I thought they would have to guarantee him at least 2.5 million.

could be, which would be a shame. If that happened, I would hope for a total clusterhump in the SEC plus Cal beating USC, USC beating ND, and Texas losing the Big XII game. Then you'l have a bunch of TWO loss teams to sort through (or open the door for Boise St., though they'll never get love from the pollsters) No, then you'd have an Ohio State-Michigan rematch.

I actually think so too-that's why I wanted Louisville to win last week. I think West Virginia's offense is really hard to stop, so the only great way to beat them is to have an explosive offense yourself. I knew Rutgers or Pitt would have a hard time beating WV, but they would have a chance beating an equally good but more traditional Louisville. Won't that be a great scene though? That game is not till December 2nd, which I think is the same day as the conference championship games-everything coming down to one day.

When Aram is a Dodger next week my point will be more clear. What exactly is your point? That the likely 2-3 million dollars at the most are what kept Aramis from resigning? Or are you saying Hendry totally ignored Aramis to get this done? 2-3 Million kept us from Furcal last year. I will say I think Hendry has been negilgent in getting this deal done for a while now. Had he approached Aram in Sept and offered 4/80 I'm sure Aram would have signed. IMO I think there was a attitude that Aram could not command over 15/per from any team. They failed to account for the fact that it was A. A thin FA class. B. Aramis was the only 3B worth a damn. Now they should just bite the bullet and give him 16-17-18 per..whatever it takes. Is it overpaying, of course, but it is well worth it. If he offered 4/80 in September, of course Aramis would have taken it-and we would have all called Hendry crazy. Are you sure you typed that right? 20 a year is really, really high.

#3 Fair or not, I doubt the pollsters put them anywhere near that high. I see them lower in the top 10, somewhere around 7 or 8 probably. What that says about the voters? Well, everyone can decide that for themselves. Let's go Rutgers! Finish this one out!

at least ahead of WVU, right? I would think they would have to go ahead of both Louisville and WVU and into the top 10-how far they would actually go, I don't know. I've just never remembered a game like this where somebody could jump from 15th into the top 10 or maybe even the top 5 based on a game in November. Usually, by the time of November, you have to have the teams in front of you lose to move up-but Rutgers would have to move at least with the 1 loss teams if not higher.

The question I'm thinking is, if Rutgers win tonight (and that's still very much in doubt) and a poll was conducted tomorrow, where would they fit in the poll?