Mephistopheles

best case scenario. ruben mateo is my classic comp. although mateo's skills >>>>>>>>>>>>> pies before he wrecked his leg up. btw, all minor leaguers have best case scenario thats impressive. i mean lets talk about best case scenario from dopirak and harvey: 40 HR guys

Ryan Theriot is what he is: A pile of steaming crap.

I hope Ryan Theriot's number of starts as a Chicago Cubs for the rest of his career is less than fifty.

Sorry Truffle, it is not me. This boards homer infatuation with several cub players is unhealthy. its one of the reasons i avoided this place for so long. homers. homers cant objectively grade their own team. theyre not worth talking to so im going to stop on this topic. I cant believe how obsessed some people here are with Pie, Marmol and Hill. It's too bad. Oh and DaveArm, the budget is meaningless. If you don't have the budget to add 13 mil fine, the discussion is moot. If you do have the budget then you have to make this deal. That's been the whole point the entire time. Anyways if you dont have the money to make this deal you dont have much if anything to spend this offseason. You can try to trade salary in the deal or do Pie + Hill and get the O's to pick up some of the contract to fit it in. That would still be an excellent move for the Cubs. But no, people here wont understand it because Pie is the next Carlos Beltran...oops I mean Corey Patterson. There's a very small chance Pie develops into a force. There's a very small chance Hill develops into a force. Tejada is a force....at our biggest hole. Tejada is the answer to all of our problems. No doubt I'd prefer not to trade Hill, but in terms of value it's clearly a good trade. I jumped in this conversation when someone said they wouldnt trade any of Hill, Marmol or Pie for Tejada straight up. I said that was stupid, even with the money. Tejada's price for his services are actually below open market value no one's mentioned that. Of Hill Marmol and Pie the best value is Hill, followed by Marmol and Pie. Hill is miles ahead of Pie and Marmol. Regardless you have to take Tejada. Replacing Hill with Tejada makes the Cubs the best team in the National League next season without Mark Prior and a 5.00 ERA pitcher in the five slot. If the moneys there we should do it. With Zambrano's arm being a ticking time-bomb and Soriano and Lee on the wrong side of 30, we shouldnt be playing for after 2009 when Tejadas contract is up and Hill would still be here. Our system blows and we wont be in a good place in 2010+. Our window to win is 2007-2009.

we are not talking about the current system so the answer is not absolutely. we're talking about worth and merit not some stupid system that accepts wins as absolute.

in other news i think the old ball coach is going to give lsu a game. im saying 31-28 LSU

theres nothing wrong with trying to get them to take on salary it just isnt all that important

I wanted Larry Rothschild or Larry Dierker to take the team

The utter lack of sanity and logic in this thread is appalling. Over the course of the season the difference between Theriot and Tejada is at the worst 40 runs and probably closer to 50 runs. If we just get replacement level pitching we would break even and the definition of RP level pitching is a bit of a joke. Any pitcher bad or not and the worst potential outcome is by in large a 5 ERA. Add that 1.11 ERA difference and we're looking at a positive 25-35 run increase by the trade. There are plenty of cheap starters who could post a 5 ERA out there. Is a 30 run difference worth 13 million? you bet your ass it is. Not to mention we have a replacement level guy in the wings and if Mark Prior... Its the smart rational move, I expected everyone here to get it Pie or Marmol would be gone in a heart beat. Easy

oml this unbelievable. i cant believe some of you are all over hills hill so much

I think any team that goes 12-0, unless it like a Hawaii situation, deserves some kudos because it's a tough thing to do. the question is would a 0 loss Penn State team going to have a better case than one loss LSU and one loss UF teams? The answer is probably not.

Whats ironic is that I pretty much only "attack the post not the poster" but the poster takes it personally even though Im dont what Im supposed to do.

6th in MLB is a loaded statistic. Thats good for what? 5th in the NL? Thats above average but not great.

Really? His OPS is right around .800, trending downward, and he's making a ton of money. Hill is a good SP making nothing, Marmol is a dominant reliever making almost nothing. You could make a case for Pie as he hasn't done anything yet, but I'm not sure it would be a good idea. But Tejada is going to be 32 next year, and if his decline continues to a sub-.800 OPS, he really won't have much value at all. ton of money is not 13 mil these days. His EqA this season is .294 after three straight seasons of .300. I can't even begin to describe the offensive contributions of a .300 EqA SS. To put it into comparison, he's Derrek Lee playing SS.

Stop with the personal attacks. I did NOT call anyone dumb. You explicitly called me dumb and the axe should be dropped on your posting privileges because of it. And no I am not wrong. His deal is what? 13 million for 08 and 13 million for 09? We can easily have this money to spend and at the going market price for players it's a steal of a deal. We're not the Yankees, but we're not the Pirates. This deal can work. It's not a unmovable contract. If you think we can't make this deal then you would have to accept that we have NO funds to make ANY deals this offseason. If thats the case the problem becomes simply which is better: Hill + Theriot/Cedeno or Tejada + RP. The latter is better

Not necessarily because if you lower strikeouts to lower walks then you raise hits. So you're back at square one. Since walks are more desirable than hits, you would likely take the higher walk rate. Although there's a trade-off sensitivity specifically you need dBB/dK if walk rate is a function of strikeout rate among other things for a given pitcher.

oml i thought i lost to imb. 5-5 overall and the first tie breaker was ERA which I ended up winning by pure dumb luck thanks be to kent.

Michigan by two touchdowns.

Id trade pie, or marmol, or hill for tejada straight up. youd be dumb if you didnt so i guess that makes some of you dumb

70% playoff probability iirc

walks are more desirable than hits. A single scores just as much as a walk. Don't make it seem otherwise and I am teaching you this.

the rays havent exactly produced anything outside their top five picks.

two of the BEST minds here (teehee) responding to me: No he doesn't. Yea, under what strange thought process?

for all the talk of benching Cliff Floyd in favor of Matt Murton, Cliff is slugging close to Murtons OPS in September. Nevermind Cliffys numbers since the ASB > Murtons. I mean just shut up

zooks not that bad of a coach. hes just not urban or steve