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Kelly did that when he took over, save 1 guy. Not a bad idea when the program needs an overhaul.

His last four recruiting classes were ranked at 56, 40, 87, and 43. Not so good... Yet 3 straight Rose Bowls (the last one at least gets an asterisk). I read some analysis somewhere a few years ago that concluded, I think, that OL was where recruiting services miss with stars more than any other and often pretty badly. I think this analysis was stars v. making an NFL roster or something like that, so I guess if stars aren't intended to predict NFL prospects maybe it's not relevant. But teams like Wisconsin, Iowa, BC comes to mind, seem to find or create out of nothing some pretty talented lineman among the riff raff.

Yes, I respond much differently than andy. That we're both nd fans is about as far as the similarities go. It may seem as though I've responded to every post about ND but that's not actually true. I largely let abuck have his fun without bothering to address it (at least not directly). Didn't respond to imb's posts about Te'o. Have ignored several bitter little comments from sponge whose just mad that Laney is still around. Often the discussion is interesting to me, but so many people hate ND (yes Careless, I realize this is 100% my fault; I do have a lot of influence), whenever it comes up the shots start flying from everywhere. Now that they're #1 and winning awards again, it'll get worse. I try to pick my battles at times, but some posters seem to want to ignore the actual content of my posts in favor of their spin on them. Admittedly that will lead to more drawn out discussions.

Don't worry...the anti-ND bias in the media will prevent him from becoming one of the highest finishing pure defenders ever. Still waiting for all those pro-ND media members you were touting. Lou Holtz, Digger Phelps, Michael Golic? I'm jumping into this convo without knowing anything about it so don't mind me. Please don't. You bitch about me discussing ND 2 days ago and then jump into a discussion with frankly a stupid addition. And I didn't bitch at you for discussing ND, just for flying off the handle whenever ND haters riled you up. Don't assume that everyone that posts here shares your crazy angry reactions. At no point has my blood pressure increased or have I been throwing things in anger. I'm mostly laughing at some pretty dumb comments.

Coach of the #1 team that started the year unranked and widely believed hugest draft pick TE win awards? More pro-ND bias obviously. Can't be merit. Why isn't Eifert considered ND's best player? Offensively he is. If not for Te'o and the fact that ND won many games by scoring 10 points and then daring other teams to score, he would be. He was told last year that he needed to improve his blocking to improve his draft stock and he did. Spent much of the year on the line blocking and setting the edge, which killed his TD numbers.

Coach of the #1 team that started the year unranked and widely believed highest draft pick TE win awards? More pro-ND bias obviously. Can't be merit.

That's not so much because of some grand conspiracy as because the Heisman has been ESPNized. Almost every year now someone wins by a gigantic margin because ESPN has taken to spending the last month or so of the season pimping somebody as the front-runner. The only times in recent years that haven't brought a giant margin are years like 2009 where literally no one stands out at all (except Suh, who was robbed, but whatever). Suh stands a good example of a much more dominant college player who couldn't reach the top three in the heisman. But Te'o is being held back because of the anti-ND bias. Right. I was actually going to add to that post that if Suh, who clearly had a more dominant season than Manti did, couldn't get it then obviously Manti won't. I think if Suh had won that year, Manti would have a better shot. I do think Te'o's effect on games is being undervalued because he doesn't have many sacks or TFL's in a defense specifically designed so that he won't get them, though. If ND didn't have a good front four, Te'o would have much better numbers in the 'sexier' categories. (Of course, if they didn't have a good front four, they wouldn't be 12-0 either.) The fact that his near-record picks are being ignored and that his relative lack of sacks in a defense in which he doesn't blitz are being held up against him is sort of stupid. Also, Suh is widely considered among the dirtiest players in the game, which may not have helped.

That's like saying there's a pro-Cubs media contingent and citing Ernie Banks, Ron Santo and some guy who played for the Cubs and has two kids on the current team. The original assertion by MR was that there was an anti-ND bias in the media and NOBODY was pro-ND. Which is ludicrous when there are immediate and obvious examples out there who went to ND and live and breathe ND on the air all the time. You can say it as many times as you want but it doesn't make it true. What I said was that the anti-ND bias was harming Te'o (see, again, guys like Mariotti not even putting him on the ballot and writing an article attacking ND). I have said multiple times that a pro-ND bias also exists in pockets. The reason I ask for examples, as I've also said, is that I think people have false presumptions about this large pro-ND contingent that hasn't existed in 30+ years. The Wilbon example is a great one. The fact is, any time a media member says anything positive about ND, many people immediately assume it's bc that media person has a pro-ND bias. It doesn't take much digging to discover that isn't true. But most people, including you, don't want to take the time to analyze their own bias. That's fine, but I'm not an idiot for asking you to do so.

Don't worry...the anti-ND bias in the media will prevent him from becoming one of the highest finishing pure defenders ever. Still waiting for all those pro-ND media members you were touting. Michael Wilbon and Tony Kornheiser, who I have heard on multiple occasions say that college football is better if Notre Dame is good and that if Notre Dame went undefeated (this was when Bama, Oregon and KSt were undefeated) that they should be in the title game no questions asked. There's two prominent ones. I'm sure there are plenty others. Lots of media folks want ND to be good bc it means more eyeballs. What you reference isn't pro ND any more than saying two other undefeated teams should be in ahead of ND is anti-ND. The stuff I posted yesterday from Mariotti and Embrem with their attacks on ND is what I'm talking about when I say anti-ND bias. Being neutral isn't bias either way. But Wilbon has been pretty anti-ND for some time. He's also a NW guy, so that not surprising. Google Wilbon and ND and the first two links are his article attacking ND for firing Willingham and a chat in which he accepts and answers several questions about ND including that he loves watching ND lose, it's been overrated for 20 years and Kelly is a blowhard. Again, ND doesn't need any more of this favorable bias.

Don't worry...the anti-ND bias in the media will prevent him from becoming one of the highest finishing pure defenders ever. Still waiting for all those pro-ND media members you were touting. Lou Holtz, Digger Phelps, Michael Golic? I'm jumping into this convo without knowing anything about it so don't mind me. Please don't. You bitch about me discussing ND 2 days ago and then jump into a discussion with frankly a stupid addition.

You shouldn't be ashamed, defensive metrics are about as reliable as a crack whore. I like Barney more than most here, but comparing him and Cabrerra as SS is stupid. Comparing 2 players is stupid? Um that makes no sense at all.

Thought this was a slide Castro slide post for a minute

Don't worry...the anti-ND bias in the media will prevent him from becoming one of the highest finishing pure defenders ever. Still waiting for all those pro-ND media members you were touting.

Woodson didn't win the award bc of his cover skills.

It's amazing how touchy people get about things that are either factual or at least undisputed. It's factual, undisputed, and irrelevant. Oh no! Theo's replacement isn't as good as Theo was! That proves that Theo is bad or something, because...others aren't as good as him.... The quality of Theo's handpicked replacement is irrelevant to the Cubs when he's also handpicking the guys to put in charge of the Cubs? Theo is in charge of the cubs baseball ops. He's picking guys to help him run the team; those guys aren't running the team in his absence. It's an important distinction to this stupid tangent you've taken us on.

That's what I suspect. Plus there really isn't any good football in Kentucky and won't be forever, so you'd get all 8 of the TVs in that state. Someone get Big Jim on the phone. :((((((((((( I think Stoops was a great hire for UK. Brooks showed that you can win a couple of games in conference, dominate weaker out of conference schools, and go to a bowl game every year. Most Kentuckians are happy with that. The test for Stoops will be if he can go beyond a 7-5 record and the Music City Bowl. If he can, excellent. If not, this was probably a bad decision on his part. Unless he turns Kentucky around and goes beyond what the program did under Brooks, I don't see how he could use this job as a stepping stone type gig. He would have been better off staying at FSU (or waiting for somewhere like Wisconsin). Haha. Love you man

Is that unusual? Wisconsin seems to make a living off of turning 3-star lineman and a decent set of RBs into a tough ground game. I don't recall seeing them at the top of many team ranking lists

1. I don't pay enough attention to know who anyone's teams are outside of a few people. The ND/Big 10 lovers are all jumbled together in my mind since there are so many of you here. I do know that SSR has a huge hard on for me, for some unknown reason. 2. Plays with integrity? WTF does that even mean? The Heisman "annually recognizes the outstanding college football player whose performance best exhibits the pursuit of excellence with integrity." Straight from the horse's mouth. If you don't like it, take it up with them. Lol, this may be the first time that anybody has actually cared about the playing with integrity clause in the Heisman mission statement. Within the last 10 years, the Heisman has been won by Cam Newton, Troy Smith and Reggie Bush. Tebow's personality was often cited in his support.

He was probably sick of the low grad rates, and wanted to go to a conference that puts the student first in student-athlete. Impeccable timing! http://www.gse.upenn.edu/equity/sites/gse.upenn.edu.equity/files/publications/Harper_Williams_and_Blackman_%282013%29.pdf African American athlete graduation rates Northwestern 83% Notre Dame 81% Ohio State 38% Wisconsin 40% Purdue 45% Michigan 54% MSU 45% Iowa 50% Indiana 36% Neb 45% Okla 38% Texas 43% UCLA 46% Stanford 68% USC 43% Alabama 56% Florida 34% Georgia 53% LSU 41% Texas A&M 38% Clemson 39% FSU 34% No Carolina 51% Lowest? Iowa State University 30% Jesus, abuck

A quick glance shows that Ismail, Quinn and Brooks were the only ND guys in the top 10 of voting at all since Brown. It's not like ND is annually getting guys to NY and getting shut out by the evil anti-ND voters. ND simply hasn't had many Heisman caliber players in the last quarter century oh my [expletive] god. I DIDN'T BRING UP THE HEISMAN, BANEDON DID. you guys can get pissed at me for talking about ND all the time, but this is the stupid [expletive] I'm dealing with.

Winners by school in the last 24 years. ND: 0 I've never disputed that there was an ND bias. It's long since swung the other way. Holding on to this belief as if we're stuck in the 70s when very few teams traveled as much as ND with the amount of success and popularity of ND is foolish to put it gently. I feel your pain, Illinois also has none in the last 24 year and I personally am sick of the haters holding us down. Are you guys trying to miss the point? I asked for evidence of recent pro-ND bias, Banedon cited Heisman winner totals and I pointed out ND hasn't won one since Tim Brown. Hard to argue Heisman voting has favored ND recently with that fact.

Because that's so much worse than the MAC/WAC/FCS non-conference Wisconsin has had for the last few years. No one's commended Wisconsin for the difficulty of their schedule is the difference there. Bingo.

Deal can't be announced until he grows an acceptable mustache.

I didn't really want to argue, but I thought the idea of there being some unnamed anti-ND media contingent was pretty bizarre. Enough people voted for Te'o to make him a Heisman finalist and both the AP and Harris have had ND No. 1 for several weeks. If they wanted to put the screws to ND they did a terrible job of it. I've put several names to the contingent. Also ND only became #1 bc every other team lost and some are still voting other teams ahead of them (in some cases, multiple teams). As I said, the fact that the lone undefeated team is #1 isn't evidence of bias or not. It's the default position. If you don't want to substantively discuss something, why make a ridiculous comment at all?

Oh dear lord. Nah, you're right. Also, too, Sagarin is anti-ND. If you want to argue, fine, make some actual arguments. But trolling with stupidity like this isn't going to work. The fact that the only undefeated team is ranked #1 tells us nothing about bias.