OleMissCub

Without question get Asinof's "Eight Men Out". Definitely one of the better baseball books I've read. Number one easily being "Cobb" by Al Stump.

http://www.retroimg.com/work/hindenburg.jpg

Burrell? I said valuable... Aaron Rowand is a free agent at the end of the season. Be nice to have him come our way. Send Fontenot, Jock/Pagan, and Petrick/Wuertz their way.

Moses wasn't even born yet when that trailer remix was created. New material plz

CF Pierre SS Neifi 1B Lenny Harris 3B Macias oh, nevermind this is too depressing :) http://www.gifflix.com/data/thumbnails/15/Kickinnuts3_2.gif

That made me laugh out loud. I needed a laugh tonight.

He actually wasn't that bad as far as the game was concerned. Most of his problems were off the field issues. Ruth had far more suspensions and fines than Cobb and I'd argue that Ruth's off the field problems might have even been worse. Furthermore, in The Glory of Their Times, Lawrence Ritter interviewed over two dozen elderly deadball era players in 1962 and asked each of them whether they thought Cobb was an underhanded or dirty player; not a single one said that he was. In fact, the first players strike ever was in defense of Cobb. When he went into the stands and beat up the guy who happened to have no hands, his teammates were right behind in the stands with their bats keeping people away from him so he could beat the guy up without interference. When Cobb was suspended the entire team went on strike in protest and swore they wouldn't play until he was reinstated. The Tigers owner, Frank Navin, was such a cheapskate that he didn't want to forfeit the gate, so he went out and got a bunch of people from local neighborhoods to fill in against the Athletics. The Tigers players actually showed up in street clothes, bought tickets, and watched the game. Following the horrific spectacle of having local people play professionals, AL President Ban Johnson reinstated Cobb. That's still the only time in MLB history that amateurs played in an official game against professionals.

We don't. But we can't punish people because of speculation. For all we know Hank Aaron bet on baseball (I'd stake my life on the fact that Aaron never did...but my point remains). The hall if full of scumbags, even the Sultan of Swat literally punched out two different umpires, threw dirt in the face of another, ran up in the stands and beat a fan who insulted him ala Ty Cobb, gambled thousands of dollars, had several paternity suits filed against him, etc.

Indeed. I read 8 Men Out a few years ago after seeing the film and it's pretty sad what happened to Buck. He was put in a tough spot because a baseball team is a tight fraternity and he certainly didn't want to snitch on his friends.

YAAAAAAAAAAA!!!! YAAAA!!!!!!!

Braun misplayed that.

No kidding. Soto is also better defensively. Kendall's throws down to second haven't even been close whereas Soto appeared to be putting it right on the money.

Good player, but not HOF-wothy. Interesting that the team also had HOFers Eddie Collins and Red Faber.

Agreed. We really just need steady play from that position.

The problem you're failing to recognize is that, if he bets on a game, he may do something stupid like mess up the bullpen for the next several days just to try to win one game. Sometimes a manager needs to look at the bigger picture and realize that at times you need to think of future consequences (such as burning out the bullpen or leaving a starter in too long) resulting from going all out today. Yes, a manager's job is to win, but from the bigger picture of winning enough to make the postseason as opposed to winning one specific game. Basically, it's the idea that sometimes you need to lose the battle in order to win the war. Fair points certainly. My main beef is that it happened as a manager and not as a player.

Correct. I don't buy into the "he was too stupid to understand" malarkey that is so often associated with that tale. He knew what he was doing. That said, baseball at that time was far different than it is now. If I wasn't getting the respect or income that I deserved from an EXTREMELY wealthy owner like Comiskey, whom I had won over 100 games for, I would have rolled over just to stick it to him as well.

How are people so clueless to still hold this opinion? Has the NBA ref scandal not shown the problems with gambling on a sport you participate in? It doesn't have to be a direct throwing of a game. There's a difference in the NBA ref and what Rose did. Rose mostly bet on games he wasn't involved in and when he did bet on his own team, he bet on them to win....which is his job as their manager. Again, none of that matters to me because there's no evidence he did it as a player. A managerial career and a playing career are DIFFERENT thing.

So that logic leaves out Lou Gehrig, Sam Crawford, Billy Williams, Charlie Gehringer, Yogi Berra, Harry Heilmann, Juan Marichal, Willie McCovey, Enos Slaughter, Willie Stargell, Mickey Cochrane, Roy Campanella, etc * edit: just saw that other people had already replied in a similar vein. I just saw that statement and had to comment it on it immediately.

He's borderline. He compares similarly to many of his contemporary pitchers who made it into the hall such as Chief Bender, Jack Chesbro, and Stan Coveleski. His 2.38 lifetime ERA is 26th all time. Jackson and Rose are no brainers as far as baseball skills are concerned.

I understand the logic for being against Cicotte and Jackson given that what they did occurred on the field, but Rose's issue didn't occur as a player, but as a manager.

I say all 3 should get in Pete: Got in trouble as a MANAGER. That shouldn't effect his legacy as a player. Furthermore, as far as we know, he bet on his team to WIN. I'm not sure I see a huge problem with that. Jackson and Cicotte: I would have done the same thing they did if Charles Comiskey owned me as a player and treated me like he did them.

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/8008/rosemf0.jpg Pete Rose: 4256 hits, 1314 RBI, 746 2B, .303 avg, 1 MVP http://dictionary.laborlawtalk.com/prev_wiki/images/thumb/8/8f/180px-EddieCicotte55.jpg Eddie Cicotte: 14 year career: 208 wins, 35 shutouts, 2.38 lifetime ERA http://www.hickoksports.com/images/jackson_joe.jpg Joe Jackson: 10 year career: 1772 hits, .356 avg, .423 obp

Interesting. I actually think Hilton is the most sane out of the trio. For some odd reason I think that as well. We haven't heard much from her at all since she got released.

I know this is morbid, but I heard someone on the radio talking about it today and I think it's an interesting question. My bet is on Lohan.

Was that Ellis Burks who yelled at the crowd: "you don't care if he's a cheat, so long as he's YOUR cheat!"