David

You mean Hoops (or his source, I guess) is completely making this up? Either way, I'm on board the Crisp bandwagon too, though I hadn't realized how much his numbers had suffered since going to the Red Sox.

The D'Backs sweeping us in the playoffs isn't changing my mind that their record last year was a fluke. They gave up more runs than they scored. It's going to catch up to them. And yes, I understand that they got great production out of their bullpen last year, which would help explain their situation with the pythag, somewhat. That's still something else that's hard to repeat or predict. Bullpen performance seems to be inherently pretty flukish. Haren is a really nice addition, though. As for Johnson, I don't really think he has much in the tank at age 44. He made what, 9 or 10 starts last year? I'm not saying they aren't a decent team, but I can't put them as top 2 in the NL. I'm not even sure that I'd put them ahead of the Cubs.

Freaking sweet! \:D/

Same. It's not like we didn't enjoy the hell out of the 2006 Bears just because they didn't finish the deal. That was probably aided by the fact that all season I expected the Bears to reach the SB but lose, but I'd probably feel the same way about the Cubs going into a Series, unless a mediocre team managed to get through the AL.

You also have to factor in that he's probably going to get like 25 mil per year for 5 or 6 years. I'm not saying that makes it a bad deal, just that it's a huge element that needs to be accounted for.

Well... If he's in the AL, that's one more round he has to get through before we'd face him, and thus one more chance for his team to get knocked out. Plus, if we do face him and manage to get lucky enough to win when we face him, at least it'd be for the Series and not just the pennant, but I digress.

I know it's against the religion of this board to say anything positive about Andy MacPhail, but perhaps this Bedard thing with Seattle has been drawn out because the Orioles wanted to see what the Twins got for Santana. My thinking is that MacPhail was tipped off by somebody in the league office over the weekend that the Santana trade would be going down soon, so he decided to wait it out. I think we'll see Bedard dealt in the next 48 hours. My gut says Seattle too, but I wouldn't rule out a NL contender seeing as the Mets just improved themselves. What NL contender? Maybe Cincy? Perhaps Philly? The Dodgers are out after the Japanese guy they signed. Astros don't have enough to pry loose a Mike Hampton much less Bedard. Maybe St. Louis. The ONLY 3 NL contenders (or possible contenders) for Bedard would be Cubs/Cards/Reds. So, I agree with a couple of other guys, and say Bedard stays in the AL. The Cardinals and Reds are contenders? Can you name an "NL Contender" that would be interested in acquiring Bedard? I think Hoops was alluding mainly to the Cubs, considering the topic of the thread. I think he's implying that because the Mets just got Santana, the Cubs might feel inclined to go for Bedard. I could be wrong, though.

Guerra does have the ceiling to be a #1 if he ever got that curveball. I can't believe the Twins didn't get Fernando Martinez out of this trade at least. Awful, it sounded like the Red Sox were offering more a few months ago in those rumored trades. How would Veal, Gallagher, Pie, and Ceda compare to that package? Just for the sake of speculation. I know it wasn't likely the Cubs could afford to pay him, given the situation. The Mets will have to extend Santana at something close to full market value. If you look at all the young talent they traded plus the money involved it amounts to a huge price tag. The Cubs couldn't have afforded it. Isn't that what I said?

http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/rjo0031l.jpg

I might have made an idea for Bedard but without Roberts. I don't recall coming up with one with Bedard and Roberts. We'd probably have to go something like Felix Pie, Carlos Marmol, Sean Marshall/Sean Gallagher, Ronny Cedeno, Matt Murton and on of {Veal, Gallagher/Marshall, anyone else in the system}. Still in the end lots of spare parts for Bedard and Roberts. I know I remember something... lemme see. Oh, it was including Hill, my bad. viewtopic.php?f=6&t=45628&p=1651723#p1651723

And he batted 130 times less than Pierre. Pierre was more efficient with the bat than Theriot Pierre still blows. I don't want his noodle arm anywhere near Wrigley unless he's jogging out of the visitor's locker room. I hope you aren't for signing Lofton, then. Kenny ain't much of a CF these days. To be fair, he didn't say that his defense (arm/glove/whatever) was the reason he didn't want Pierre here.

IF (big if) you're not giving up Hill, I'm not sure I understand why we wouldn't. Not that I believe this rumor for a second.

Dude just wants hits on the website. Probably. You'd think he might be smart enough to actually spell out the name instead of just giving initials if that were the case, though. FTH is SSM?

I should probably order some more so I can sell them when the stores are all sold out after the trade is announced. PROFIT

It seems like the Khalil Greene love has spread to that board too. Meph's influence knows no bounds.

No doubt. I ordered both my jersey t-shirts already.

I don't have a problem with Roberts, but I still don't get why we just don't go for Bedard solo if he's still available. Hendry clearly seems to have a hard-on for Roberts. Maybe Piniella really wants a fast guy who can hit lefty and get on base. At least we "lost out" on the Kaz derby.

Yea, as much as I hate (despise) the Pie puns, something about that whole part about it not being the pastry is sort of funny.

Is there even any conceivable way we could get Bedard and Roberts without giving up Hill? I can't really see it at all. But Meph did propose an idea before (not remembering what the deal was right now).

Thought this could use it's own thread rather than getting lost in the 140+ pages of the other Roberts mega-thread. It's not the most reliable source (to say the absolute least), but it's worth discussing considering we're in the dog days of the offseason. Given that disclaimer, don't shoot the messenger. http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185694&page=5

I'm glad neither team got him, or we would be hearing about Johan Santana, as much as we are hearing about Tom Brady. The Mets getting Santana---at a VERY steep, but worth, IMO---doesn't really affect us, so I am not really concerned about it. How does it not affect us? Assuming we even got that far, how would you like facing Santana 3 times in a 7 game NLCS? There's a chance the Cubs wouldn't face him in the regular season. And the playoffs? We should cross that bridge when we (or they) get there. Letting a pitcher---even the one of Santana's ability---to affect you mentally, then maybe you should find players who likes the challenge. Again, if the Cubs have a strong enough mental and physical team in 2008, then facing a guy like Santana SHOULD NOT affect the Cubs. You have to beat the best, to become the best. I don't even understand your logic. You'd rather strengthen a likely playoff opponent by giving them a pitcher that is often unhittable than hear about Santana on the Red Sox (or Yankees) on ESPN? If we have to face him on one of those teams in the World Series, THEN so be it. We'll cross THAT bridge when we get there. Even if we're lucky enough not to face him in the regular season, it all comes down to what happens in the playoffs. The fact is, this deal makes the Mets a very imposing roadblock if we want to get to the Series. So be it....I rather cross that bridge WE WHEN GET TO THE PLAYOFFS. I do agree it is a roadblock with Santana/Martinez at the front of the rotation, but making it to the World Series, is ever easy. And hopefully come playoff time, if against the Mets, Z/Lilly (or whoever is the #2 at the time) is as imposing as a Santana/Martinez. But right now, I'm not sweating it. I still have no idea why you'd rather the Mets get him than the Red Sox or Yanks, which is why this discussion started in the first place. Just because you don't want to hear him talked about on TV, seriously?

I know you didn't ask me, but I'd probably take Greene.

He hit .293 which would've been towards the top for this team. Not to mention the 60+ SBs he brings to the table. I'd rather have Pie in CF just for the sake of developing a young guy by letting him play. But if he goes, I'd take Pierre over w/e trash you have in mind (Byrd?) any day. Are you seriously citing batting average? Come on.

I'm glad neither team got him, or we would be hearing about Johan Santana, as much as we are hearing about Tom Brady. The Mets getting Santana---at a VERY steep, but worth, IMO---doesn't really affect us, so I am not really concerned about it. How does it not affect us? Assuming we even got that far, how would you like facing Santana 3 times in a 7 game NLCS? There's a chance the Cubs wouldn't face him in the regular season. And the playoffs? We should cross that bridge when we (or they) get there. Letting a pitcher---even the one of Santana's ability---to affect you mentally, then maybe you should find players who likes the challenge. Again, if the Cubs have a strong enough mental and physical team in 2008, then facing a guy like Santana SHOULD NOT affect the Cubs. You have to beat the best, to become the best. I don't even understand your logic. You'd rather strengthen a likely playoff opponent by giving them a pitcher that is often unhittable than hear about Santana on the Red Sox (or Yankees) on ESPN? If we have to face him on one of those teams in the World Series, THEN so be it. We'll cross THAT bridge when we get there. Even if we're lucky enough not to face him in the regular season, it all comes down to what happens in the playoffs. The fact is, this deal makes the Mets a very imposing roadblock if we want to get to the Series.

Guerra does have the ceiling to be a #1 if he ever got that curveball. I can't believe the Twins didn't get Fernando Martinez out of this trade at least. Awful, it sounded like the Red Sox were offering more a few months ago in those rumored trades. How would Veal, Gallagher, Pie, and Ceda compare to that package? Just for the sake of speculation. I know it wasn't likely the Cubs could afford to pay him, given the situation.