CubfaninCA

and the offense would be left with what exactly? Isn't durable and innings eater the same thing? Trade for Floyd. If you haven't noticed, pitching wins titles. EDIT: Aren't you the same guy who said "Don't expect alot from Murton next year." I want a top 5 offense. There's no reason this team can't have a top 5 ERA and top 5 runs scored in the NL, with at least one of those being top 3. I would not assume Murton will give you great production in LF. I would expect him to be fine for a $300,000 LF. But I would construct the rest of my roster with the expectation that Murton won't be the rookie of the year (I know he's ineligible). In other words, get a productive RF bat. If you deal Murton and Williams for a pitcher, then you not only have to get a productive RF, but now you have to also get a LF. It's opening up another hole, and counterproductive. Tweak the offense some and it can sneak into the top 5. The problems w/ the offense are over-dramatized here. Hendry just needs to get 1 and 2 hitters who are more likely to stay healthy than what they had. In all, I'd rather have a #1 or 2 pitching staff and a 5 or 6 offense, than a 1 or 2 offence and a 5 or 6 rotation. The current rotation is quite shaky. Hendry needs to sure it up.

and the offense would be left with what exactly? Isn't durable and innings eater the same thing? Trade for Floyd. If you haven't noticed, pitching wins titles. EDIT: Aren't you the same guy who said "Don't expect alot from Murton next year." I want a top 5 offense. There's no reason this team can't have a top 5 ERA and top 5 runs scored in the NL, with at least one of those being top 3. I would not assume Murton will give you great production in LF. I would expect him to be fine for a $300,000 LF. But I would construct the rest of my roster with the expectation that Murton won't be the rookie of the year (I know he's ineligible). In other words, get a productive RF bat. If you deal Murton and Williams for a pitcher, then you not only have to get a productive RF, but now you have to also get a LF. It's opening up another hole, and counterproductive. Tweak the offense some and it can sneak into the top 5. The problems w/ the offense are over-dramatized here. Hendry just needs to get 1 and 2 hitters who are more likely to stay healthy than what they had. In all, I'd rather have a #1 or 2 pitching staff and a 5 or 6 offense, than a 1 or 2 offence and a 5 or 6 rotation. The current rotation is quite shaky. Hendry needs to sure it up.

and the offense would be left with what exactly? Isn't durable and innings eater the same thing? Trade for Floyd. If you haven't noticed, pitching wins titles. So, I trade a young starter and a cheap productive outfielder to get Zito. And then I have to trade even more young, cheap talent for Floyd, even though I'm still not certain he can stay healthy. I'm not sure I make those moves. I would still have to find a CF, RF, and SS. With Murton in LF, I can still look to trade for a fifth starter or use Williams and I only need to find a CF, RF, and SS and still have the players to trade for one. I'm not sure those series of moves you suggest would improve this team. It just moves the problems around. Well, I said Zito and another player. They may be able to get Floyd for Walker. Then move Cedeno to 2b. Alot hinges on getting Furcal though. That's the first domino that needs to fall in place.

and the offense would be left with what exactly? Isn't durable and innings eater the same thing? Trade for Floyd. If you haven't noticed, pitching wins titles. EDIT: Aren't you the same guy who said "Don't expect alot from Murton next year."

Could Williams and Murton get the Cubs Zito and another player? Zito would basically give the Cubs a #2 starter, who is durable (BIG PLUS) and can eat some innings.

Why don't we ask the Mets to give us Cameron ($6M), Floyd ($6.5M) and Glavine ($9.5M) in a pure salary dump move for some prospects? With the $22M they save here, and the $15M freed up with Piazza as free agent, the Mets can trade for Mannys' $20M and Delgado's $16M. We fill the needs for CF, RF and a >200IP/<4.00ERA SP. And, all 3 guys we get are free agents after 2006. I like that thinking. To further entice the Mets we could offer some major league talent like Williams and Patterson. Would the Mets be interested in Williams, Patterson, Nolasco, and Ryu for Cameron, Floyd, and Glavine. The Cubs could still give Furcal a nice deal and have this line-up: SS Furcal 2b Walker 1b Lee 3b Ramirez RF Floyd C Barrett LF Murton CF Cameron With a rotation of Zambrano Prior Wood Maddux Glavine Hopefully Maddux and Glavine will find their old stuff as they play together on the golf course again. That team can win a World Series. Of course, a lot of things have to go right, but that's the case for any world series winner.

You're not sure you want Glavine, Floyd, and Cameron. Well, we could go with Rusch, Burnitz, and Patterson. I'm not sure I want to pay $22m for those three and give up talent in return (I'm guessing Walker to start, plus a solid bat and at least 1 arm). Glavine has been a disappointment in NY. Shea helps him quite a bit, in Wrigley I'm not sure how well he'd do. Cameron has a shaky history, with OBPs as low as .285 as a 25 year old (sound familiar?), while Floyd has as bad an injury history as anybody that got hurt for the Cubs in 2005. I'd be more than happy to have either one of those OF on the team next year. Cameron is fine for CF. Floyd can be a major improvement over Burnitz. But all 3 for $22m? I'm not sure you solve enough of the team's problems after spending all that, and I'd guess you'd open up other holes after making the trade. So you're holding out for Giles, Damon & Burnett? After the Cubs whiff on those three what's the backup plan?? Go w/ the kids?

The Mighty 1090 outta San Diego is a solid station. With the exceptoin of Bill Warndell (Philly Billy) they don't have a bunch of clowns like the Score or 570 out of LA. Vic the Brick Jacobs on 570 LA takes the cake for biggest fool on sports radio. The absolute worse. Be happy he's not in Chicago.

Why don't we ask the Mets to give us Cameron ($6M), Floyd ($6.5M) and Glavine ($9.5M) in a pure salary dump move for some prospects? With the $22M they save here, and the $15M freed up with Piazza as free agent, the Mets can trade for Mannys' $20M and Delgado's $16M. We fill the needs for CF, RF and a >200IP/<4.00ERA SP. And, all 3 guys we get are free agents after 2006. That's a good thought. Only trouble is that, unless CPatt were out of the picture, would it give Dusty an excuse to bench Murton? Put Patterson in the deal to the Mets. The Mets can then deal Beltran to Boston for Manny, and Kris Benson to Miami for Delgado. What's their rotation look like after dealing Benson and Glavine?? Pedro, Zambrano, Seo and?? Seems they need to pick up someone like Millwood in free agency to make all this work. Looks like they would have the money to do that after this particular sequence of deals. I really doubt that Minaya would be so bold. Nor am I sure that I'd want Glavine, Floyd, and Cameron. Glavine, Floyd & Cameron would be a helluva pickup for the Cubs. You get a pitcher coming off a 3.50 season, a corner OF coming off a .860 ops and Cameron can give the Cubs great d and a .820 ops in cf. Also, all these guys are free agents. The Cubs would have to give up Patterson and Jerome Williams for starters.

Why don't we ask the Mets to give us Cameron ($6M), Floyd ($6.5M) and Glavine ($9.5M) in a pure salary dump move for some prospects? With the $22M they save here, and the $15M freed up with Piazza as free agent, the Mets can trade for Mannys' $20M and Delgado's $16M. We fill the needs for CF, RF and a >200IP/<4.00ERA SP. And, all 3 guys we get are free agents after 2006. That's a good thought. Only trouble is that, unless CPatt were out of the picture, would it give Dusty an excuse to bench Murton? Put Patterson in the deal to the Mets. The Mets can then deal Beltran to Boston for Manny, and Kris Benson to Miami for Delgado. What's their rotation look like after dealing Benson and Glavine?? Pedro, Zambrano, Seo and?? Seems they need to pick up someone like Millwood in free agency to make all this work.

Beltran. Hey, just like Boras got his A+++ client out of Texas, he'll get his A+ client out of Shea. Aren't they kinda gutting themselves to get Manny. It's basically 4 good players for Manny. If they could get Delgado, they might be alright, but do they have the prospects and players??

Can't see NY dealing off Glavine and his 3.50 ERA.

Why don't we ask the Mets to give us Cameron ($6M), Floyd ($6.5M) and Glavine ($9.5M) in a pure salary dump move for some prospects? With the $22M they save here, and the $15M freed up with Piazza as free agent, the Mets can trade for Mannys' $20M and Delgado's $16M. We fill the needs for CF, RF and a >200IP/<4.00ERA SP. And, all 3 guys we get are free agents after 2006. What does NY have left to deal for Manny though?

Well Manny should be available, but I doubt the Trib has the cajones to pursue him. Also, he may not even want to come to Chicago after the Sosa fiasco.... Altogether, there isn't a long list of great OF's. ONly 10 OF's had an ops over .900. People need to set the expectations bar a little lower.

I'm not up on what the Reds have but I thought they had a gluten of OF's and needed pitching. Probably the case, but my point is would you be willing to deal Pie as part of a deal for Dunn that includes giving up at least one good pitching prospect, like a Nolasco. if hendry wont give up hill for dunn, there is no way he even considers giving up pie for dunn. pie isnt going anywhere except back to west tenn next year. Hendry may have spun off his chair when he said that. I wouldn't be surprised to see Pie dealt for someone like Soriano. This board will absolutely implode then. i would be very suprised if pie were traded and very very disgusted if he were traded for soriano. i think lofton will be the stop gap signed for this year with a club option for next year to give pie more time to develop in aa/aaa. Sori seems like the type of guy Hendry overvalues, and he apparently went after him hard in July. Hendry's also the same guy who signed Burnitz, so anything's possible. I wouldn't mind Pie being traded, but I'd want a better player. Doubtful Cincy would deal Dunn tho.

I'm not up on what the Reds have but I thought they had a gluten of OF's and needed pitching. Probably the case, but my point is would you be willing to deal Pie as part of a deal for Dunn that includes giving up at least one good pitching prospect, like a Nolasco. if hendry wont give up hill for dunn, there is no way he even considers giving up pie for dunn. pie isnt going anywhere except back to west tenn next year. Hendry may have spun off his chair when he said that. I wouldn't be surprised to see Pie dealt for someone like Soriano. This board will absolutely implode then.

Not a bad option @ all. Highly unlikely the Cubs pick up a .900+ ops guy for rf. There's like 4 of them iirc. Am not sure what the Mets would want for him though.

Dye would have looked real good in a Cubs uniform. If Contrereas isn't just lightning in a bottle, the Sox will be good for a while. Buerhle, Garland and Garcia are pretty tough.

If it's Hill & Patterson who else would you want from Florida? I wouldn't mind @ all giving up Mitre or Wellemeyer along w/ Patterson.

You have a feeling....yet no facts on which to base that feeling. I have a feeling that Pierre is in regression and what we saw of him in 2005 will be what to expect in 2006 if not worse. I can't back it up, but I think you should trust my feeling. Well you do have Yoda as your avator, so you may know something I don't. In conclusion, the "cw" hasn't been debunked since there's not 100 years of stats on the topic. Anyone else getting sick of the overuse of this abbreviation in this thread? Not as sick as I am of seeing people completely forget to turn their brains on when reading a thread. Clever insult. Sorry that some of us do not possess an Ivy League diploma like you. It doesnt take an Ivy League education to know that you shouldnt present something as fact without actual facts, and that the correct pattern for entering a thread is to read>comprehend>post. Sorry for having an opinion. Also, pass this along to CPatt who claimed that speed at the order helping hitting has been debunked. I guess he's an idiot as well.

You have a feeling....yet no facts on which to base that feeling. I have a feeling that Pierre is in regression and what we saw of him in 2005 will be what to expect in 2006 if not worse. I can't back it up, but I think you should trust my feeling. Well you do have Yoda as your avator, so you may know something I don't. In conclusion, the "cw" hasn't been debunked since there's not 100 years of stats on the topic. Anyone else getting sick of the overuse of this abbreviation in this thread? Not as sick as I am of seeing people completely forget to turn their brains on when reading a thread. Clever insult. Sorry that some of us do not possess an Ivy League diploma like you.

You have a feeling....yet no facts on which to base that feeling. I have a feeling that Pierre is in regression and what we saw of him in 2005 will be what to expect in 2006 if not worse. I can't back it up, but I think you should trust my feeling. Well you do have Yoda as your avator, so you may know something I don't. In conclusion, the "cw" hasn't been debunked since there's not 100 years of stats on the topic.

You're the one saying that Pierre distracts pitchers. Where's the proof? And again you've completely missed the point about injuries. Hairston when healthy is Pierre's equal, yet no one is looking at his production and sees "leadoff man extraordinaire, if only he could stay healthy". 100 years of baseball is the proof. Hairston is not his equal even when throwing out reality and playing fantasy baseball. Pierre's ability to steal bases far surpasses Hairston. Where? Do you have the data that shows a speedy hitter on base helps the number two hitter? I'd like to see that data for the last 100 years. You'd have to factor in the 3, 4 and possibly 5 hitter as well. Perhaps the data's not there cause Bill James couldn't produce anything that fits his premise?? Maybe Fred can put something together? Before knocking James, at least he's done some research. Do you have any data to support your contention. Just my groundbreaking work on Furcal and Giles. :) As I've said a few times, I'll go w/ the cw. Pitchers, hitters and managers may know a little something. So, you've proven that one speedy lead-off hitter has helped one number two hitter. How do you know that isn't the anomaly? BTW, do you know how many times conventional wisdom has been proven wrong by the field of research? Pitchers, hitters, and managers may know something. That is true. But it is just as likely that they may believe something that is false simply because they have heard it so many times. That's where research comes in. Yes cw has been proven wrong many times, but cw holds true sometimes as well. I have a feeling a good amount of pitchers would say that having guys on like Furcal and Pierre bothers them. It's a matter of certain hitters coming through. Some guys like Castillo just don't.

You're the one saying that Pierre distracts pitchers. Where's the proof? And again you've completely missed the point about injuries. Hairston when healthy is Pierre's equal, yet no one is looking at his production and sees "leadoff man extraordinaire, if only he could stay healthy". 100 years of baseball is the proof. Hairston is not his equal even when throwing out reality and playing fantasy baseball. Pierre's ability to steal bases far surpasses Hairston. Where? Do you have the data that shows a speedy hitter on base helps the number two hitter? I'd like to see that data for the last 100 years. You'd have to factor in the 3, 4 and possibly 5 hitter as well. Perhaps the data's not there cause Bill James couldn't produce anything that fits his premise?? Maybe Fred can put something together? Before knocking James, at least he's done some research. Do you have any data to support your contention. Just my groundbreaking work on Furcal and Giles. :) As I've said a few times, I'll go w/ the cw. Pitchers, hitters and managers may know a little something. Not to be a smart ass (because I don't know), has James contributed to a World Champion team? I ask because I remember his theory on closer by committee, I think it was in Boston, and that didn't seem to work out as well as his research suggested. Am pretty sure he consults w/ Epstein in Boston. His input has helped the offense, and he should be given some credit for last year. Perhaps he's the guy who told Theo to let Pedro walk though?

If it's true he's staying in SD, it may be just as well. Giles could have signed with STL before even considering the Cubs. With Sanders ($4M) and Walker ($6M) both free agents, and Roger Cedeno off the books ($1.5M), STL could have easily paid Giles $10-12M per year. That type of dough and the chance to win year-in/year-out is hard to pass up. Let's see if we get confirmation reports in the next 12 hours about re-signing with SD. That's about the most positive spin to put on it. Thankfully's he not going to St. Louis.