CubColtPacer

You mean the Colt dragged down in the middle of the field wasn't a penalty in your eyes? Even the announcer said that Norv Turner had no room to complain after seeing the replay.

I don't think that deal would even be enough. The Orioles wouldn't really want both Pie and Colvin because they would have to put one of them in LF, which wouldn't maximize their talents. They'd probably want Pie, Marmol, Gallagher, Ceda, Murton, Patterson, and Cedeno. It simply wouldn't be worth it. The Cubs don't have enough high end talent in their minors to risk it all on an injury prone pitcher for the most part. If Bedard goes down for a significant amount of time next year, the Cubs would probably be in organizational trouble for the next 5 years.

Lofton would be a terrible platoon partner for Pie. Neither of them can hit left-handers whatsoever.

I feel compelled to pick an upset, if only to differentiate from the crowd slightly. Seattle, New England, Indy, Dallas

As for these two points, I am not so sure I am liking either one. Byrd had a very solid year last year (.307/.355/.459), but he has only had 2 previous seasons with an OPS above .700. I guess I could live with him as a backup getting the occasional start, but he had better not take much PT from Pie. Honestly I would rather have a cheaper in-house option. Does anyone think Leiber is much better than Dempster or Marquis? Well, I am not a fan of either potential move. I think Lieber would be a lot better than Dempster when you consider how much going back to Chicago is going to help his numbers. Is he better than Marquis? It's hard to tell. Marquis has the better chance of being an above average pitcher this year, but he also has a much better chance of being terrible as well. Lieber will most likely be around average and doesn't have that much variability. I would love to have a cheaper in-house option than Byrd as well, but who is there? The Cubs traded their only possible option in Pagan, and he wasn't a great option. The Cubs don't have anybody in the minors who can both play center and hit against left-handers.

Thank God, hopefully this is finally over and Cedeno gets a shot at short!!! Sean Gallagher, too. I'm of the opinion that Gallagher might be better served getting some time in at AAA first. He might do fine at the major league level, but he's only had 40 innings at AAA. Give him some more time to dominate down there and maybe we won't have the Ronny Cedeno story with Gallagher where he was rushed up, struggled, and then banished.

Byrd's about as inconsistent as they come. Looking over his numbers, his overall numbers and his left/right splits jump all over the place. He wouldn't be a terrible option though if the Cubs don't give up all that much. If the Cubs sign Lieber, I think that pretty much shuts the door for Dempster going to the rotation. I still think they would look to trade for somebody else at that point. That's a lot of competition at the end of the 25 man roster, and at least 1 pitcher would need to be traded.

Nah, he's a little too old..instead, they just got the younger version instead. First Tiller: http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/badger/mugs/2006/joetiller.jpg Now Brimley: http://www.nndb.com/people/593/000022527/wilford-brimley-crop.jpg Now Hope: http://www.ekusports.com/stats/Rosters_Images/Hope_Danny.jpg How does Purdue find all these guys?

I can't see that. DeRosa was the starter at 2nd with Theriot at SS, and DeRosa was the starter at 2nd when Izturis was at short last year. Theriot would certainly get a lot of time at 2nd when DeRosa moved around to the other positions, but DeRosa would be the starter there.

Walt Jocketty advising Wayne Krivsky...maybe those relievers will have had arm surgeries beforehand now. http://www.kypost.com/content/wcposhared/story.aspx?content_id=b9e8a273-ba49-4e5d-89cc-659cd4531978

I wonder if Rich Hill's projections have to go up a little bit now that Cameron is inside the division.

I doubt that the Cubs will start DeRosa at SS. More than likely, DeRosa goes into the supersub role. He would be a huge upgrade to the bench, while Roberts would be a small upgrade at 2B, but given the rumors, it will cost us Cedeno. With the emergence of Geovany Soto, the signing of Fukudome, and the apparent determination that Pie will be the CF, Theriot at SS is the Cubs' worst position. Therefore, it's the place the Cubs should seek to upgrade, internally or externally -- whatever is possible. Now, if getting Roberts means that DeRosa plays SS (again, I doubt it), that would be good. Otherwise, let Cedeno and Theriot compete or acquire a SS. One of Greene, Peralta, Wilson, or Lopez could be available. The key here is upgrading from last season's production at SS. But have the Cubs even mentioned that they might try DeRosa @ SS? I've been wondering why I keep hearing it every once in awhile on nsbb. The Cubs had ample opportunity to try Mark out @ SS last year, yet he played 1 game at the position. The Cubs didn't exactly have a second baseman last year either to plug in if DeRosa was there for most of the year either. The Cubs do value Theriot's defense at short over DeRosa's, we know that (otherwise they would have played DeRosa at SS and Theriot at 2nd). Do they hate DeRosa's defense enough to know if they would play Theriot there even when the other one would sit on the bench? I don't think anybody knows that, and what we do know is that Lou is willing to try almost anything if the starter is struggling. Lou was willing to play Ward in RF in small ballparks because he needed more offense. If Theriot is struggling and DeRosa is just sitting there on the bench, Lou might go to him.

This is no more meaningful than when they tried Theriot as an OF last year..they like versatility. That's it. From the Cubs perspective, the more positions he knows, the more valuable of a utility player he is.

Calm down. Rosenthal just said the Cubs might be looking for a center fielder, so he threw their name in. It bothers me that anytime there is what appears to be a purely speculative rumor, we read a barrage of posts saying that "The Cubs are so stupid" and "Hendry is a moron." The problem is that Hendry has made enough moves in the past that warrant those types of posts. If he had a history of selling high, buying low and making deals that 6 months down the road look great, people would give him the benefit of the doubt and figure he already has something lined up to improve elsewhere( #2 SP, SS etc). Currently, some think he makes moves on the spur of the moment or just to make a move. I just think he's inconsistent is his judgement of what the Cubs really need. Sometimes he fills a need with a great deal, sometimes he fills a need that doesn't exist. Agreed, but the more people say that the more people remember it wrong that Hendry was actually interested. We had a few people bring up his supposed interest in Steve Finley last offseason as a mark against Hendry, and that couldn't have been further from the truth (that Hendry was at all interested). There have been other times when writers just put the Cubs in a list of speculation like this rumor, and Hendry doesn't do it, but the next time speculation comes up about another player in 6 months at least one or two people will say "remember how Hendry was interested in Melky? he's an idiot". Another example-think of how many people still hold it against Hendry that he didn't trade Prior for Tejada and Bedard? We heard that several times here in the Prior discussions, when in actuality that deal was never even close to being on the table.

As SSR has pointed out, his ERA has actually been right around league average for starting pitchers. It hasn't been awful. Plus, look at his home and away ERA splits from his time with the Cubs, and his time with the Phillies: Cubs: 99 Home: 4.20, Away: 3.99 00 Home: 3.71, Away: 5.15 01 Home: 3.39, Away: 4.24 02 Home: 3.09, Away: 4.31 Phillies 05 Home: 4.38, Away: 4.05 06 Home: 5.18, Away: 4.64 07 Home: 5.26, Away: 4.19 The last 3 years in Chicago, Lieber dominated at Wrigley. His road ERA was over a point over his his home ERA each season, which is a dramatic split. As you can see, his time with the Phillies has been hurt by their very hard ballpark to pitch in with home ERA's being worse than road ERA's every year. Take him out of Philly and put him in Wrigley again? His numbers most likely improve, not regress. At worst he'll likely be a league average starter once again, which is a better guarantee than you can say for Dempster. Now, knowing that Lieber has been a ground ball pitcher when he is going good, has his GB/FB ratio taken a hit in the last few years that would make his Philly #'s out of whack since the ball jumps out of there? I seem to recall that him keeping the ball down was the reason for his success with the Cubs. Actually no. He's never been that much of a ground ball pitcher since coming from the Pirates. 1999-1.33 2000-1.69 2001-1.34 2002-1.23 2004-1.43 2005-1.29 2006-1.23 2007-1.52 So as you can see, he's remained pretty consistent in ground ball percentage over the years with a couple outliers. And badnews, I'm not trying to point out his numbers from 99-02 as an indication that he could ever be that good again. I pointed it out to show that he thrived in Wrigley Field. If he came to the Cubs, I'd expect his home split to be better or at least equal to his road split next year. If he had pitched in Wrigley the last 3 seasons instead of Citizens Bank Park, his numbers would have likely been a lot better. His road split the last few seasons hasn't been bad at all..he'd still be a league average pitcher or better in a ballpark that doesn't favor offense so much.

...so that means, he's still unsigned? Quick somebody call JH! I hope that's sarcasm. Would someone please, tell "cubcolt" that I was being sarcastic. Got it...just not used to people starting threads to be sarcastic, so you had me fooled.

As SSR has pointed out, his ERA has actually been right around league average for starting pitchers. It hasn't been awful. Plus, look at his home and away ERA splits from his time with the Cubs, and his time with the Phillies: Cubs: 99 Home: 4.20, Away: 3.99 00 Home: 3.71, Away: 5.15 01 Home: 3.39, Away: 4.24 02 Home: 3.09, Away: 4.31 Phillies 05 Home: 4.38, Away: 4.05 06 Home: 5.18, Away: 4.64 07 Home: 5.26, Away: 4.19 The last 3 years in Chicago, Lieber dominated at Wrigley. His road ERA was over a point over his his home ERA each season, which is a dramatic split. As you can see, his time with the Phillies has been hurt by their very hard ballpark to pitch in with home ERA's being worse than road ERA's every year. Take him out of Philly and put him in Wrigley again? His numbers most likely improve, not regress. At worst he'll likely be a league average starter once again, which is a better guarantee than you can say for Dempster.

...so that means, he's still unsigned? Quick somebody call JH! For what reason? He plays one of the easiest positions on the baseball field and he cannot hit. His only decent attribute, his speed, has been getting worse and worse as he gets older. Plus, he's coming off an injury riddled season. His career might be over, if some team doesn't save him with a minor league deal where he can spend most of his remaining career in AAA.

It probably takes at least 2 of those names and at least one lesser prospect to land Bedard.

Yeah.. Fat chance they take that. I think that guy has lost all prestige. He's the only one with absolutely no built up credibility to fall back on, he was way wrong on this one, and his new info is also being refuted by Bruce.

True, but we would have had an older, much less productive player that would have been signed for the next 4 years at over 6 million per year. I'd rather hope to replace the talent and get the player that's far more likely to improve the team. Do we know that he wouldn't have taken a 2 year $15M deal to come here? Do we know for sure? No, I guess not. I just don't think that a person who signs a 4 year 25 million dollar team for the team who traded for him and has a big hole at second base would willingly sign a 2 year 15 million dollar deal for a different team who has a replacement lined up if Castillo were to slump badly. Assuming it would have taken 4 years and 25 million is probably being generous. He likely would have required more to come to Chicago.

True, but we would have had an older, much less productive player that would have been signed for the next 4 years at over 6 million per year. I'd rather hope to replace the talent and get the player that's far more likely to improve the team.

Yes, it's one day closer to being done or not being done. In other words, most of what was published or broadcast yesterday was nonsense. The Cubs would still like Roberts. They are not trading Hill, Pie or Colvin for him. As I said yesterday, they're willing to give up some combination of Gallagher-Marshall-Cedeno for him, and that's it. The names of Hill, Marmol, Pie and Colvin are what the Orioles would be asking for Bedard, and the Cubs aren't in on any Bedard deal. Thanks, Bruce. Off topic, but have you heard anything about Hendry acquiring another starter or is he content with the rotation as is? Somebody asked him yesterday if Henry was looking at anybody else to acquire at the moment, and Bruce replied that they liked Lieber.

If teams continue to run on him, putting him in LF where you get the most chances by far to throw people out at the plate (and at 2nd base) might actually be worth it. I agree though that the athletic issue won't be much of an issue anymore when Pie and Fukudome are the other two outfielders. Soriano will be slotted correctly then, with his bad outfield instincts but his great arm.

We're already well past it. Check the Soriano thread in this board format. It's 91 pages and 2270 posts long. This thread is 100 pages and 2490 posts long.