JC

LOL!

Sure, but Manny plays in a short LF that reduces some of his OF issues regarding range. Further, Manny has the luxury of having a bat that compensates for a large number of his, shall we say, misfortunate decisions and/or misapplication of talent. I don't know that its an employable strategy to say, "Hit it to Manny," as opposed to, "Lay down a bunt," or "Don't throw a first pitch strike."

Are the Cubs worse fundamentally than other clubs? While my gut says yes, I can't say for sure. I can say that I don't care if other teams suck fundamentally. If there exist correctable situations on the team I root for, they ought to be corrected. Its the pattern of fundamental breakdowns that really galls me. The same mistakes occurring in all too regular fashion. Those kinds of mistakes speak to the coaching staff's ability to address team short comings, or the management's willingness to bring in fundamentally unsound players. Those characteristics, if at all accurate, are troublesome to me. The notion that "everyone is doing it" is not a plausible defense to me. I think that goes back to what Goony was saying. Everyone screws up. Sometimes it costs them games, and at the end of the year if you're on the short end of the stick then it sticks out even more. EDIT: Everything is correctable. But people are human, and what I'm trying to say is that the Cubs aren't any worse than anyone else in that aspect, so therefore there may not be a lot that can be done about it, or it's not worth putting too much effort correcting it since it's not putting us at a disadvantage. This assumes that all fundamental mistakes are equal, which I don't believe. When a pattern exists that is not addressed (pitchers not covering first, pitchers not fielding the ball, Alou getting doubled off 30 million times, swinging at the first pitch after 2 straight walks, etc.), that is a bigger problem than Manny Ramirez sliding to catch a ball and getting his cleats stuck. Yes, all mistakes are correctable. But, allowing certain mistakes to continue to be made speaks to a larger problem. At that point, fundamental mistakes become a targetable team weakness of which opposing teams may take advantage.

Are the Cubs worse fundamentally than other clubs? While my gut says yes, I can't say for sure. I can say that I don't care if other teams suck fundamentally. If there exist correctable situations on the team I root for, they ought to be corrected. Its the pattern of fundamental breakdowns that really galls me. The same mistakes occurring in all too regular fashion. Those kinds of mistakes speak to the coaching staff's ability to address team short comings, or the management's willingness to bring in fundamentally unsound players. Those characteristics, if at all accurate, are troublesome to me. The notion that "everyone is doing it" is not a plausible defense to me.

I don't think anyone is saying the only reason the Cubs are a bad team is because of fundamentals. It's just one of several reasons and they are a bad fundamental team. Are they a bad fundamental team? If Prior and Wood were healthy and effective, putting us in the WC lead, would anyone be talking about how we are a bad fundamental team? Yes, they would. Look no further than 2003. If you recall, Cub pitchers couldn't field a 16" mushball. There were various baserunning errors even before the the Alou debacle of 2004. And, look at 2004. For the most part, the Cubs were in the hunt. But, criticisms rained down on the team for their poor fundamentals, costing the Cubs the best analyst on the market. I think both immediately previous years answer your question.

Gotcha. One thing I am loathe to mention, but will anyway. Derrek's defense doesn't seem to have been up to par this year. Maybe its just me, but the errors I've seen from him have been of the sort I haven't seen in the past. I hope its just perception.

Why do you automatically equate fundamentals to bunting? I think of executing a run down properly, shifting your weight in blocking pitches in the dirt, turning a routine double play, hitting the cutoff man........ I agree, Dal. My view of fundamentals is much broader. However, I differ from you with regard to your position that you need to hear that the coaching staff is being somehow negligent until you will lay blame at their feet. While the individual player certainly deserves his share of responsibility, a pattern of fundamental breakdowns should cause increased scrutiny on the coaching staff. The instances you referenced above are all things that can be addressed throughout the year. Generally speaking, I don't think players that continue to struggle make it in the majors for extended periods. We aren't talking about young guys, here. Many of the criticisms of the Cubs' fundamental failures are from guys who have been around (Rusch, Remlinger, Walker, Barrett, Burnitz, Patterson, Macias, etc.) Why have their fundamental lapses been so prevelant under this staff? Further, what in the heck is management doing bringing in veteran players whom they know have fundamental deficiencies, if indeed the problems were so evident in the first place? There really is no way around the fact that managment and/or the coaching staff bears some burden of blame for the broad display poor fundamentals, even in the absence of someone confessing that the staff ignored dealing with the lapses.

=D> Dare I say -- smashing...

Nobody living in Alaska is smarter than me. I mean, they live in Alaska. Come on. Three words: Fort Wayne, Indiana. Five more words: Home of the Cheese Toastie.

Nobody living in Alaska is smarter than me. I mean, they live in Alaska. Come on.

This is a loaded question. It is entirely possible that Baker's erratic usage patterns and luke warm confidence have stiffled the growth of some players at his disposal. It is impossible to know for sure, but I can't imagine any skill being cultivated by not getting to practice your craft with regularity. I think Patterson is worth a crap. He has regressed since Baker has come on board. I think Dubois' minor league numbers warranted more patience and a more significant demonstration of confidence by his manager. The same can be said for Choi. While they may not be stars, they aren't complete bums. How about the asinine usage of Hill and Harris when they were brought up over the last couple of years when their minor league numbers warranted playing time? Say what you want, but Bobby Hill has value as a bench player. He has sported OBPs of .353 and .343 over the last two years as a bench player. I find value in those numbers that Baker never did. I will conclude with just 4 paragraphs this time.

Maybe he thinks being objective compels you to object to everything. Figured the smartest guy on the board could come up w/ a better insult. :o Thanx for the shot though. Listen, you are the one touting yourself to be Captain Objective. It was a more a play on words (objective --> object) than a "shot" at you. By my count, there are two people smarter than me on the board. Maybe just one since Yanr was banned.

I'm sure its not. But, the thread took on its current vibe after I mentioned Choi and Dubois here: And you later responded, referencing the same two guys here: Even if my post was considered to be vitriolic (which I don't think it was), I don't see a lot of other vitriolic efforts in this thread.

Maybe he thinks being objective compels you to object to everything.

Thank god for the injection of some objectivity. Novoa, Ohman and Wuertz? Notwithstanding the fact that there is room for debate that these three are "solid relievers", as Tim said, the discussion is obviously directed at position players. That is a common concession that is made in the argument about Dusty's bias against young players. Stop trying to change the subject.

He's being accurate by using hindsight? There's no chance in hell that Murton is hitting as well as he is b/c of his playing time compared to you know his actual hitting talents and approach at the plate. There's no reason for Dusty to try and incorporate the way he handled Murton into the logic of Murton hitting so well unless he trying to stroke his own ego (pun intentional for my last post) or pat himself on the back for a job well done while Hollandsworth stunk it up after they unloaded Lawton to the Yanks. Great job Dusty, I wish I could give him as much credit as he gives to himself and then I could accept mediocrity as "not my fault" when I screw up, but I believe in accountability. I've never seen UK more terse than in this thread. I like it.

Here is the beauty of where this thread has gone: its largely a figment of someone's imagination. Its no secret that I don't care for Dusty at all as a manager. I think he is terrible. However, that really isn't reflected in this thread. Rather, CubfaninCA took exception to my mention of Choi and Dubois and misinterpreted my post. I took exception to Baker taking credit for Murton's success. I read Dusty's comments as defensive (fairly commonplace for Dusty) and self congratulatory rather than crediting Murton and his hard work. There is no acknowledgement of the tremendous season he had in the minors, nor is there any acknowledgement that Murton's discipline does not adhere to Dusty's well documented approach. CubfaninCA jumped on me, making general accusations of vitriol and implying that I said Dusty ruined Choi and Dubois. In fact, I wrote no such thing. Instead, I used Choi and Dubois as examples to demonstrate that Dusty's "system" or "strategy" isn't foolproof for young hitters. He said the same things with respect to them as he just did for Murton. I just thought it was relevant to reference a couple of guys that Dusty's young hitter approach didn't fair well with. I don't care for Dusty Baker, but that doesn't mean every criticism of mine is steeped in bias, as is implied. Actually, a close reading of thread evidences that I agreed Choi and Dubois' struggles could well have been from the fact that they just aren't good ML batters. Of course, that concession is lost in the zeal to attack Dusty antagonists and/or apologize for the man. To think, it all could have been avoided with relative ease.

Am I the only one who has very little interest in Damon?

maybe cause they aren't very good Maybe they aren't. But, seeing how Dusty makes up his system as he goes, with no real rhyme or reason other than being distrustful of young hitters, I see no reason to believe that Dusty's handling of Murton led to his success.

It doesn't matter whether they were awful or not. The only reason they aren't currently playing in front of Murton is because Hollandsworth and Lawton are with the Braves and Yankees, respectively. If they remained on the roster, I guarantee that Murton would not have gotten the number of ABs he currently has.

2006 Cubs Convention: MC: Now, we'll open it up for some frank thoughts from management about the upcoming season. No questions, please, except from those who have been pre-screened. Ron, from San Fransisco: Dusty, when are you coming back? We really need you! Dusty: Thanks, Ron. But, boy, I've got work to do here, you know what I'm saying? I came here with a plan and after we had success in 2003, everyone wanted to speed the plan up. But, plans are like striped bass. They only have so many fins and can't swim any faster no matter how many bait fish are chasing them. One day I had this lure... Hendry (breaking in): We have no intention of letting Dusty go. In fact, I'd like to take this opportunity to announce that Dusty has signed a life time contract to manage the Cubs. We are very excited. Ted, from Downer's Grove: How do you guys develop such fundamentally sound hitters like Matt Murton? Hendry: I have no idea. Dusty: Well, I don't know if we have no idea. I mean, when I first came up, I had 17 hits in my first 9 at bats. I didn't look to do none of that walkin' stuff. Its called hittin', not walkin', right? You know what I'm sayin? Murton didn't do a whole lot in the Cub farm system. Heck, I think he only played half a season of minor league ball. I had a plan when he arrived and I stuck to it. If it wasn't for me, Cline and Sarge, but mostly me, Murton wouldn't have had any success. But, boy, you can't teach speed, and guys with red hair are never fast. You never see someone from Ireland win the 100 yard dash in the Olympics, do you? I mean, when is the last time they held an Olympics in Ireland? Those people can't take the heat according to my mom who teaches phonics. MC: Next question. Quickly. Chad, from Skokie: How do you keep such a positive attitude in the dugout? As a follow up, how do you get so many quality free agents wanting to come to play at Wrigley? MacPhail: Well, we always sell out the ballpark. People like to play in front of big crowds. Dusty: Me. They love me. And, they know I'll go to the playoffs like I did every year since 1992. Shoot, I'm never home before the middle of October. Hendry: I don't know. Kevin, from Lincoln Park: With respect to OBP from the top of the ord... MC: Only approved questions. Next. Josh, from Skokie: Were you happy with Corey Peterson's decision not to play Winter Ball? Sorry, Corey Patterson. The card you gave me is hard to read... Hendry: Uh, yes, well, uh, we'll fix that. Anyway, we expect Patterson to be in center field when the season starts. The rest of the outfield should fix itself. We've brought in Jeff Conine who should receive about 156 starts in left field. He is a big character guy with championship experience. Also, we think Preston Wilson should supply the kind of tools and leadership we need in the outfield. While we had lunch with Brian Giles, we thought it better to save that money for a mid-season acquisition. Baker: Corey Patterson still has the ability to leadoff. You can't teach speed, man. We are working to teach him to be more aggressive running to first when he strikes out. I've already set aside the first offday to revise his entire swing. MC: It looks like a great season ahead. Thanks, gentlemen.

Can Dusty compliment a young player without patting himself on the back? If his "system" is so sound, why didn't it work for Hee Seop, or Dubois?

I'm still intrigued by the idea of putting Helton at 1B and getting a stud OFer for Lee. I seem to remember a recent report from Colorado, however, indicating that Helton would not be on the offseason market. Of course, Colorado's temperature probably changes daily with that regard. Or, they are just positioning themselves better for an offseason move of Helton, rather than calling him a liar and threatening to make public a videotape showing him to be a liar.

I was going to make some snide comment about the author but I think Tim wrote it best. Off topic, but who was Snidely Whiplash? Was he Dudley Doright's antagonist? He certainly was. Boy does that bring back childhood memories. Yeah. Dudley was on right around the same time as Tennessee Tuxedo when I'd come home from Kindergarten.

Having Milton Bradley and Jose Guillen in the same outfield would be exciting, in its own way.