bring stone back

What do you expect them to do? Keep throwing him out there every 5th day and watch him melt down again? It's been brought up by him and the organization - Hill has some serious mental/confidence issues and sometimes he's his own worst enemy. This is the smart thing to do. Put him in the bullpen, give him the time and space he needs to correct his issues and let him earn his way back to the rotation. We have a pitcher in the pen who will actually improve the staff until Hill gets back to himself. How again is this a bad thing when the team actually will improve for the short term? Let me guess, you're also one of the guys who complain about Pie getting replaced although Pie looks completely overmatched when he gets his opportunities and Johnson is clearly outplaying him. quit while you're ahead. and by "ahead" i mean "way behind." Because I disagree with you? How dare I do such a thing? Again, the arrogance on this board is ridiculous. It's not like they're trading Hill or putting him in exile. Quite the opposite actually, in my opinion they're coddling him a bit much and letting him work out his mechanical and confidence issues WHILE improving the rotation in the short term. Why is this difficult to understand?

What do you expect them to do? Keep throwing him out there every 5th day and watch him melt down again? It's been brought up by him and the organization - Hill has some serious mental/confidence issues and sometimes he's his own worst enemy. This is the smart thing to do. Put him in the bullpen, give him the time and space he needs to correct his issues and let him earn his way back to the rotation. We have a pitcher in the pen who will actually improve the staff until Hill gets back to himself. How again is this a bad thing when the team actually will improve for the short term? you act like hill pooped his pants and ate the rosin bag on the mound while walking 22 straight hitters or something. he's had ONE bad start. ONE. now he has "mental issues"? you can tell a guy has mental issues based on watching him throw a baseball? wow, when i think about the great psychological figures of the past few hundred years, i think of freud, bf skinner and bring stone back from nsbb. honestly, that's some great company. let's just hope that, thanks to you, hill gets the psychological help he needs before he kills again. gotta love the condescending tone from a guy that can't see the difference between hill, a 28 year old pitcher in his third season (following a season in which he was among the NL leaders in a handful of categories) and pie, a 23 year old outfielder in essentially his first big league season. good call though. Wow, I didn't realize I was thought of so highly in the psychological business. Hill and the organization have both stated that often he "gets in his own way" and does far too much thinking on the mound and even he stated he is his own worst enemy out there. Considering I have actually worked with sports psychologists I think this would be something to explore with Hill. Love the, "before he kills again" comment. I can really appreciate the hyperbole and putting words in one's mouth so you can add more validity to your argument. Well played, sir... Let Lieber take his spot the next 2-3 starts while Hill can gain back some confidence in long/middle relief and figure out his mechanical/confidence issues in the bullpen. What is so damn difficult to figure out? The organization gives Hill and opportunity to right himself AND imporove in the short term. Oh, the humanity...

What do you expect them to do? Keep throwing him out there every 5th day and watch him melt down again? It's been brought up by him and the organization - Hill has some serious mental/confidence issues and sometimes he's his own worst enemy. This is the smart thing to do. Put him in the bullpen, give him the time and space he needs to correct his issues and let him earn his way back to the rotation. We have a pitcher in the pen who will actually improve the staff until Hill gets back to himself. How again is this a bad thing when the team actually will improve for the short term? Let me guess, you're also one of the guys who complain about Pie getting replaced although Pie looks completely overmatched when he gets his opportunities and Johnson is clearly outplaying him.

He makes Theriot look good at the plate...

yeah, right I didn't mean this game. He will sometime...probably.

Theriot will come through with a gapper...

Okay, I'm converted. I was one of those in the camp of "Theriot sucks - but he's the best we got." Screw it and just play Cedeno. I'm watching on MLB gameday - was it a well placed gapper or a shot over the CF's head?

I would not be opposed to those moves but why Pie so high and DeRosa so low? If you were to flip them I'd be on board. I would not want my #5 hitter to be an offensive liability like Pie who at times will be completely overwhelmed at this level and will struggle to just make contact.

I'm just guessing but it's probably because Ryan Theriot has outperformed Ronny Cedeno at the major league level. Just a guess... If Theriot is just short of terrible, that makes Cedeno what - far short of terrible then? This is not a difficult argument. Ryan Theriot is a below average baseball player - we all know that. However, he is the best shortstop the Cubs have and better than Cedeno. LOL ya, it must mean nothing that Cedeno has outperformed Theriot everywhere else, and at a younger age. Theriot obviously just has what it takes to succeed at the major league level, while Ronny doesn't. Damn all those crazy minor league numbers that say Ronny is far better at baseball. It's a different game in the minors. They're not playing baseball. Or something. You're right, Cedeno has outperformed Theriot in the minor leagues. Unfortunately, the Chicago Cubs play in the major leagues where Cedeno has fell flat on his face. Ryan Theriot has outperformed him in the major leagues - that is a fact and why he's playing over Cedeno. For a board so obsessed with numbers it's comical how some keep overlooking those like they don't exist. I would love to see Ronny hit and play like he did in the minors - the problem is he has not shown that at the major league level and has not shown any signs that will come soon. Theriot has at least had some success in the major leagues - Cedeno can't even claim that. Why do some receivers coming out of college football put up big numbers, get awards, get drafted high while having all the measurables but just don't succeed and are sometimes outperformed by undrafted free agents? I don't know why but I do know it happens. Unless you can pitch as well, you are not a successful major league player if you hit like Ryan Theriot. Instead of reading what you want to enhance your argument I suggest you read what I actually wrote. I said Theriot has at least had SOME success in the major leagues. I did not say he was a successful player - just that he has had some. Big difference.

I am ALL for the Cubs upgrading at shortstop and wanted Hendry to focus on doing such instead of chasing Roberts. That being said, it didn't happen and Theriot is indeed our best shortstop and will continue to play. Who is Lou supposed to pencil in at shortstop, "N/A" or "we're looking for something better" and just play 8 in the field until we trade for someone else?

I'm just guessing but it's probably because Ryan Theriot has outperformed Ronny Cedeno at the major league level. Just a guess... If Theriot is just short of terrible, that makes Cedeno what - far short of terrible then? This is not a difficult argument. Ryan Theriot is a below average baseball player - we all know that. However, he is the best shortstop the Cubs have and better than Cedeno. No, Ronny Cedeno is a much better baseball player than Ryan Theriot. The numbers and past history suggests otherwise.

I'm just guessing but it's probably because Ryan Theriot has outperformed Ronny Cedeno at the major league level. Just a guess... If Theriot is just short of terrible, that makes Cedeno what - far short of terrible then? This is not a difficult argument. Ryan Theriot is a below average baseball player - we all know that. However, he is the best shortstop the Cubs have and better than Cedeno. LOL ya, it must mean nothing that Cedeno has outperformed Theriot everywhere else, and at a younger age. Theriot obviously just has what it takes to succeed at the major league level, while Ronny doesn't. Damn all those crazy minor league numbers that say Ronny is far better at baseball. It's a different game in the minors. They're not playing baseball. Or something. You're right, Cedeno has outperformed Theriot in the minor leagues. Unfortunately, the Chicago Cubs play in the major leagues where Cedeno has fell flat on his face. Ryan Theriot has outperformed him in the major leagues - that is a fact and why he's playing over Cedeno. For a board so obsessed with numbers it's comical how some keep overlooking those like they don't exist. I would love to see Ronny hit and play like he did in the minors - the problem is he has not shown that at the major league level and has not shown any signs that will come soon. Theriot has at least had some success in the major leagues - Cedeno can't even claim that. Why do some receivers coming out of college football put up big numbers, get awards, get drafted high while having all the measurables but just don't succeed and are sometimes outperformed by undrafted free agents? I don't know why but I do know it happens.

They look great - not too big at all. Nice photos.

I'm just guessing but it's probably because Ryan Theriot has outperformed Ronny Cedeno at the major league level. Just a guess... If Theriot is just short of terrible, that makes Cedeno what - far short of terrible then? This is not a difficult argument. Ryan Theriot is a below average baseball player - we all know that. However, he is the best shortstop the Cubs have and better than Cedeno.

no, he really isn't Yes, he really is. I can only think of one other person on the team who plays shortstop and you can't be talking about Cedeno. Who is this anonymous shortstop? I can be talking about Cedeno, for one. DeRosa would also be better. You're right - you can be talking about Cedeno...it just wouldn't make for a very good argument.

No because he made stupid mistakes and was lazy. Now you're just making things up. How did he make stupid mistakes? How was he lazy? Wasn't Theriot the one who sat at home all winter while Cedeno played winter ball and tried to improve? Yes, Ryan Theriot just sat on his ass in Louisiana ALL winter long and refused to do anything to improve his baseball skills, being in better shape or being a better baseball player overall. What a silly comment. Since Cedeno worked so hard to improve over the winter compared to Theriot (as you allege) wouldn't that make Cedeno now "gritty"?

no, he really isn't Yes, he really is. I can only think of one other person on the team who plays shortstop and you can't be talking about Cedeno. Who is this anonymous shortstop? Cedeno. I know he's not white or gritty enough, but he's still no worse than Theriot. His past major league performances beg to differ. Tell me that you want to try DeRosa at short or make a trade - great, I'm ALL for that. Let's do it, but Cedeno isn't better than Theriot. He just isn't.

So would I. Where is this guy then? Playing for the Iowa Cubs? That's what I just don't understand about this argument. If we had a better player then I'm ALL for benching Theriot. Problem is, that better player does not play for the Chicago Cubs right now.

no, he really isn't Yes, he really is. I can only think of one other person on the team who plays shortstop and you can't be talking about Cedeno. Who is this anonymous shortstop?

While Felix Pie has really crushed the ball in the major leagues, right? So I guess it's safe to assume he'll be horrible, too? As I said in another post, when the Chicago Cubs start playing the Omaha Royals - let me know. Cedeno raked in the minor leagues - why isn't he starting in front of Theriot? His minor league stats suggest he should... your post makes my brain hurt The arrogance by many on this board makes mine hurt. Pie and Cedeno have better minor league numbers - therefore it will just automatically translate to success at the major league despite what their past performances have shown us. I know so because numbers support my claim - despite what the actual play on the field suggests. Pay no attention to that.... Arrogance? There was nothing about your post that made sense. Pie and Cedeno have put up really, really good numbers in the minor leagues, and Pie was usually very young for his level. Ryan Theriot never put up really, really good numbers and was often very old for his level. Ryan Theriot has done nothing in the major leagues to have an everyday job handed to him, while guys like Pie and Cedeno have proven, based on their minor league numbers, that they deserve a shot. What I said was just because Pie and Cedeno did well in the minor leagues it doesn't always equate to success at the major league level. How hard was that to understand? Many here want to see Cedeno start in front of Theriot based on potential and minor league performance while forgetting the fact Cedeno failed miserably when given the opportunity at the major league level. Theriot was not good, true, but he was/is better then Cedeno. Many are so quick to bash Theriot's defense, his lack of power, etc. Funny - they're all better than what Cedeno has done in the major leagues...if Theriot sucks that bad how would you describe Cedeno? Yes, I thought it was stupid Hendry didn't make improving shorstop priority #1 in the offseason but Theriot is the best we got. I wish that wasn't the case and we had another viable option but it sure isn't Ronny Cedeno.

While Felix Pie has really crushed the ball in the major leagues, right? So I guess it's safe to assume he'll be horrible, too? As I said in another post, when the Chicago Cubs start playing the Omaha Royals - let me know. Cedeno raked in the minor leagues - why isn't he starting in front of Theriot? His minor league stats suggest he should... Interesting argument that you make here, because I would start Cedeno at SS if the choice is Cedeno or Theriot. We know exactly what we have in Theriot. He's a light hitting utility infielder, much like the dozens upon dozens of other light hitting utility infielders throughout the league. Cedeno and Pie have potential to be much more. That is the key phrase - potential. The problem is, Cedeno has never shown anything at the major league level - ever. At least Theriot has. Granted, it was for a month and a half but that is a month and a half longer than Cedeno. This board is so funny sometimes. People bitch and moan about no championships forever, the team needs to win now, we're serious about it - yet people call for lineups and personnel changes built on more "upside" and potential. Ryan Theriot is a better major league shortstop than Ronny Cedeno and that is why he is starting. I will not be surprised in the least bit if this board is debating 2-3 years from now why Pie hasn't "figured it out" because he has so much upside and potential with great minor league numbers.

While Felix Pie has really crushed the ball in the major leagues, right? So I guess it's safe to assume he'll be horrible, too? As I said in another post, when the Chicago Cubs start playing the Omaha Royals - let me know. Cedeno raked in the minor leagues - why isn't he starting in front of Theriot? His minor league stats suggest he should... your post makes my brain hurt The arrogance by many on this board makes mine hurt. Pie and Cedeno have better minor league numbers - therefore it will just automatically translate to success at the major league despite what their past performances have shown us. I know so because numbers support my claim - despite what the actual play on the field suggests. Pay no attention to that....

While Felix Pie has really crushed the ball in the major leagues, right? So I guess it's safe to assume he'll be horrible, too? As I said in another post, when the Chicago Cubs start playing the Omaha Royals - let me know. Cedeno raked in the minor leagues - why isn't he starting in front of Theriot? His minor league stats suggest he should...

In the immortal words of Lloyd Christmas, "Pick him up!" With Lieber and Dempster always on shaky ground and in their last years and Marquis being...well....Marquis - it can't hurt anything. How expensive can this guy be if the Nats just let him go?

BBB already showed that Theriot is worse, but even if he weren't, Pie's particular weakness in approach has a larger chance of getting exploited by hitting 8th. With his ability/potential, it doesn't make sense to put him there. Pie's weakness will continue to be exploited until he figures out how to adjust. It really doesn't matter if Pie hits 1st, 2nd, 7th or 8th - pitchers are going to throw him sliders in and high fastballs and he'll continue to get himself out until he figures out how to lay off those pitches. The scouting report from the opposing pitcher doesn't change just because he's hitting 7th as compared to 8th. If/when he starts outhitting Theriot and he starts to suck, as many of you consider a foregone conclusion, then slot them accordingly. Until then, hit Pie in the 8 hole.