CubfaninCA

They're playing because they're the only guys who can stay healthy, and the organization wants to crack .500 and spin the season as a success because this was a transition year (No Sammy), and they had lots of injuries.

Giles is very realistic. If the Cubs went with Walker (2.5) at 2nd and Nomar at SS (5-6 + incentives) the money will be there to pursue Giles. We went with Walker and Nomar at 2B and SS this year. That didn't work out so well for us. The only difference between this year's approach and next year's approach is that we can conceivably count on Cedeno if Nomar gets hurt. We do have money (from a lack of Sosa) to spend on the OF, but really, counting on Nomar to be healthy for a full season has a low probability of becoming reality. If we resign Nomar, it had better be at a very low base (2-4M) and high incremented PA incentive laden deal. If he does go down, we have Cedeno in the wings and money to throw away via trade mid-season. I love Nomar, but we'd better have several backup plans for SS if he stays on the team. They could have backups in Hairston and Cedeno, but my guess is that some of the pitchers are grumbling about the d. Am guessing that Zambrano's doing the most of it. Since they want to keep the pitchers happy and keep them around for a while, they'll probably tweak the d some, which probably means no more Walker and Nomar up the middle. Can see Barrett being gone too. Well then they had better get the damn bats to replace Walker, Nomar, and Barrett. Because if you think our offense sucks NOW...... I don't think the offense sucks now, but the front of the order needs to improve. Can't have Neifi and Burnitz batting 2nd and 4th again. If you get rid of Nomar, Walker, and Barrett in favor of better defense but lesser bats, this offense most definately will suck. Hardcore. If all 3 are gone, can see something like I-Rod @ catcher, Cedeno @ 2b, and Furcal @ SS. Can't see them going w/ Blanco, if they lose all 3. Bring in Lofton, along w/ a power hitter like Floyd and the offense is a little better.... Furcal, Lofton, Lee, Floyd, ARam, I-Rod, Murton, Cedeno

Giles is very realistic. If the Cubs went with Walker (2.5) at 2nd and Nomar at SS (5-6 + incentives) the money will be there to pursue Giles. We went with Walker and Nomar at 2B and SS this year. That didn't work out so well for us. The only difference between this year's approach and next year's approach is that we can conceivably count on Cedeno if Nomar gets hurt. We do have money (from a lack of Sosa) to spend on the OF, but really, counting on Nomar to be healthy for a full season has a low probability of becoming reality. If we resign Nomar, it had better be at a very low base (2-4M) and high incremented PA incentive laden deal. If he does go down, we have Cedeno in the wings and money to throw away via trade mid-season. I love Nomar, but we'd better have several backup plans for SS if he stays on the team. They could have backups in Hairston and Cedeno, but my guess is that some of the pitchers are grumbling about the d. Am guessing that Zambrano's doing the most of it. Since they want to keep the pitchers happy and keep them around for a while, they'll probably tweak the d some, which probably means no more Walker and Nomar up the middle. Can see Barrett being gone too. Well then they had better get the damn bats to replace Walker, Nomar, and Barrett. Because if you think our offense sucks NOW...... I don't think the offense sucks now, but the front of the order needs to improve. Can't have Neifi and Burnitz batting 2nd and 4th again.

Hopefully LA signs Nomar and put him LF or 3b. They can deal w/ his "fluke" injuries. I recall that Nomar was a workout maniac when he first entered the league. He has a lot of wear and tear on his body. Wouldn't be surprised if he was taking an "enhancer" too, which doesn't do the body good in the long run. I'll be shocked if he plays more than 100 games next year.

Giles is very realistic. If the Cubs went with Walker (2.5) at 2nd and Nomar at SS (5-6 + incentives) the money will be there to pursue Giles. We went with Walker and Nomar at 2B and SS this year. That didn't work out so well for us. The only difference between this year's approach and next year's approach is that we can conceivably count on Cedeno if Nomar gets hurt. We do have money (from a lack of Sosa) to spend on the OF, but really, counting on Nomar to be healthy for a full season has a low probability of becoming reality. If we resign Nomar, it had better be at a very low base (2-4M) and high incremented PA incentive laden deal. If he does go down, we have Cedeno in the wings and money to throw away via trade mid-season. I love Nomar, but we'd better have several backup plans for SS if he stays on the team. They could have backups in Hairston and Cedeno, but my guess is that some of the pitchers are grumbling about the d. Am guessing that Zambrano's doing the most of it. Since they want to keep the pitchers happy and keep them around for a while, they'll probably tweak the d some, which probably means no more Walker and Nomar up the middle. Can see Barrett being gone too.

Cmon Ramirez >>> Walker. Give me Furcal and Cedeno up the middle. Ramirez is greater than Walker, but at a much greater cost. Both should be part of the Cubs plans this season. Also they are similar relative to their competition performance wise. Both are probably close to top 5 in the league for their position without looking it up. EDIT: Ramirez is 2nd in NL 3B in OPS, Walker is 3rd among NL 2B. Ramirez is quite a bit younger though and they don't have any waiting in the wings to take over for ARam. Cedeno could play third. My point wasn't trying to say Walker is more valuable than Ramirez. Both players are much better than league average at their positions. My point was saying that there is more reasons to criticize Ramirez and chastise him as there are to do such to Walker. Considering Ramirez is due over ten million next season and Walker is due 2.5 million, I just can't fathom why people don't want Walker back at that price. I'm not going to criticize Walker, he's been alright, but he's missed a good number of games this year, so I can't consider his overall performance as good or very good. I just much prefer the guy entering his prime over the guy leaving his prime. Am curious what Walker's training regime consists of. He doesn't strike me as someone who works out hard. Perhaps I'm wrong on that though, which may change my "mind" some.

Giles is very realistic. If the Cubs went with Walker (2.5) at 2nd and Nomar at SS (5-6 + incentives) the money will be there to pursue Giles. They've had the money to do a lot of things over the years.. Burnett's probably more realistic than Giles. Anyone want to start taking bets on the Cubs getting Giles?? :o

Cmon Ramirez >>> Walker. Give me Furcal and Cedeno up the middle. Ramirez is greater than Walker, but at a much greater cost. Both should be part of the Cubs plans this season. Also they are similar relative to their competition performance wise. Both are probably close to top 5 in the league for their position without looking it up. EDIT: Ramirez is 2nd in NL 3B in OPS, Walker is 3rd among NL 2B. Ramirez is quite a bit younger though and they don't have any waiting in the wings to take over for ARam.

Yeah, let's get rid of a secondbaseman that hit 302/355/475 at 2.5 million for the sake of chemistry. :roll: Read again. There's more to it than just chemistry. He's getting older (who doesn't?) and so he might be injury-prone? Yet, you want to acquire Cliff Floyd. Cliff Floyd's an ideal clean-up guy for Baker. Murton can bat second in the order and they can give Cedeno the 2b job. With Baker at the helm? Well, my guess is that Baker will have Furcal and Lofton next year, and Murton will bat 6th or 7th. But if no Lofton, Baker may not have many options. He may go w/ Cedeno over Murton though. Unless Neifi's brought back, which I doubt. Neifi will get more money elsewhere.

Yeah, let's get rid of a secondbaseman that hit 302/355/475 at 2.5 million for the sake of chemistry. :roll: Read again. There's more to it than just chemistry. He's getting older (who doesn't?) and so he might be injury-prone? Yet, you want to acquire Cliff Floyd. Cliff Floyd's an ideal clean-up guy for Baker. Murton can bat second in the order and they can give Cedeno the 2b job. Why not keep Walker's cheap production and go for a better upgrade than Floyd? Well, I'd prefer Giles or Manny, but this the Cubs not the Yankees. Just being realistic.

Cmon Ramirez >>> Walker. Give me Furcal and Cedeno up the middle.

Yeah, let's get rid of a secondbaseman that hit 302/355/475 at 2.5 million for the sake of chemistry. :roll: Read again. There's more to it than just chemistry. He's getting older (who doesn't?) and so he might be injury-prone? Yet, you want to acquire Cliff Floyd. Cliff Floyd's an ideal clean-up guy for Baker. Murton can bat second in the order and they can give Cedeno the 2b job.

Put Rodriguez back on the roids and he'd be a great pickup. Would be nice to have better d @ the most important defensive position. However, I can see him breaking down like Garciaperra and he's not that productive anymore, so no thanx. Too expensive. Nice to hear about Burnett.

Yeah, let's get rid of a secondbaseman that hit 302/355/475 at 2.5 million for the sake of chemistry. :roll: Read again. There's more to it than just chemistry.

You're right. Let's get rid of Dusty. Agree and Nomar and Wood.

yeah, that's the problem. He's missed quite a few games this year.

god knows it worked so well last offseason They should have shaken it up more.

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

Omg Choi's not producing? Have you seen his ops??? :wink: Seriously though LA makes lots of sense. However, Giles may take precedence over Delgado due to Lowell being added. Did you have to introduce your sarcasm here? Aren't enough threads polluted with that argument already? Back to the point. I could see them going after Giles, but they will have money to spend on more than one position this offseason, especially if they trade Bradley. Lowell's had an enormously disappointing season. But he's not necessarily washed up. He might be worth a flier for the Dodgers while they wait for LaRoche or Guzman to take over third base. Not sure why you need to pick me out here when there's so many other's who are guilty of sarcasm. Perhaps if I ripped Neifi or Baker it would be ok. *shrug* Well, I'd say that part of getting along in a community is knowing how a person is going to respond if you press a particular button. Mouthing off directly to me (especially when it is out of context) about my favorite players is likely to draw a response. My feeling is that you know that and decided to push that particular button anyway. I guess you are free to play the martyr if you like, but when you purposefully stir up trouble, you really shouldn't act picked on if people respond. Honestly, I have no idea who your favorite players are, and am not sure why the martyr label needs to be spun again. Obviously I like your board (I have quite a few post here), but it seems the way to be get along in this community and "not cause trouble" is to agree that Baker and Neif are horrible and that Cub prospects should play more. Have a contrary view and you're mocked pretty good. I don't mind the sarcasm & mockery whatsoever, but if people want to dish it out, then they should be ready to take it (aka Choi and DuBois jokes). That's just my 2 cents, and I'll just quit discussing prospect flops since it hits such a nerve w/ some.

Count me in as a little worried. His ERA's good, but since he has trouble getting past the 6th or 7th, I can't consider what he's doing overall as good. Hopefully, it's a result of the early injury and he bounces back next year and becomes dominant as expected.

Omg Choi's not producing? Have you seen his ops??? :wink: Seriously though LA makes lots of sense. However, Giles may take precedence over Delgado due to Lowell being added. Did you have to introduce your sarcasm here? Aren't enough threads polluted with that argument already? Back to the point. I could see them going after Giles, but they will have money to spend on more than one position this offseason, especially if they trade Bradley. Lowell's had an enormously disappointing season. But he's not necessarily washed up. He might be worth a flier for the Dodgers while they wait for LaRoche or Guzman to take over third base. Not sure why you need to pick me out here when there's so many other's who are guilty of sarcasm. Perhaps if I ripped Neifi or Baker it would be ok. *shrug*

Omg Choi's not producing? Have you seen his ops??? :wink: Seriously though LA makes lots of sense. However, Giles may take precedence over Delgado due to Lowell being added.

Stat upon stat to support our opinions or stat upon stat to support the facts? If stats equal fact, then Baker's a good manager and there year's an aberration. Stats do equal facts. However, that does not preclude people from purposely or accidentally misapplying them to suit their needs, an example of which was demonstrated earlier in this thread. Such as?? Choi??

Stat upon stat to support our opinions or stat upon stat to support the facts? If stats equal fact, then Baker's a good manager and there year's an aberration.

Baker's experience & success in SF has made him set in his ways and stubborn as a mule. However, he hasn't had much to work w/ besides Aurilia, Patterson and Murton, and possibly Cedeno. DuBois, Choi and Calvin Murray aren't much of a smoking gun.