Handlebar McSkullet

I'm pretty much with this. I'll take Olsen, but after that I wouldn't waste a decently high pick on anyone. Maybe we can pick someone up that was undrafted thats just as good as Gabe Reid. That shouldn't be too difficult. I think this would require a change in philosophy. Clark's weakness comes from poor blocking for the most part, poor route running and poor YAC and often poor hands. The tight end in the sytem acts like a safety valve and YAC ability and route running are the most important. I think the "burner" tight ends are overrated and will be drafted high, too high to get enough value out of these types in the Bears offense to justify a higher pick. Not to argue with you Kaiser, we have done that enough, but actually Clark is regarded as one of the best blocking tight ends in the NFL. I think the whole burner thing is just to have another viable weapon on offense, which is what they need. I think you could have both Clark and Olsen on the field and would create alot of matchup problems. I would be annoyed if they drafted another WR, you dont need a high round runningback, plus you dont get much more useless than john gilmore and gabe reid.

Murton is no longer a prospect! This will be his third year in the big leagues (second full). He has shown he can produce at the major league level (and, actually, get on base at nearly the same rate as ichiro). It's not us overvaluing our prospects that makes this deal bad. This deal would be bad if we were only trading jones and murton. EDIT: also, that quote in your sig is absolutely hysterical! Wojo at his best. I meant that prospect statement in general, not Murton. I want all the world to know me as the guy who believes this: MURTON IS ACTUALLY THE HUMAN FORM OF ZEUS, BROUGHT DOWN FROM OLYMPUS TO PLEASURE US CUBS FANS WITH HIS AWESOMENESS. Aka. I think Murton is awesome, there are not a lot of MLB Players I would trade Murton for.

You have to think... we all on this board, tend to overvalue our own prospects. With that being said, I doubt it would take that much to get Ichiro anyway. He is older, he is a fa, and I think he will leave Seatle anyway. And once someone said Murton AND Gallagher, I lost interest in the trade. As far as Ichiro being overrated, his offensive prowess may be stretched a bit(or a lot). But make no mistake, that man is one amazing fielder.

Sportingnews has Zach Miller as the number one TE, and number six prospect overall. Im a big ten guy so I never saw Miller play this year. Any Thoughts?

Isn't it funny how every good GM has their niche in the draft? For example, Bill Polian of the Colts is exactly the opposite of Angelo. Polian is the best in the league at his first pick in the draft, and he is the best in the league at picking up great undrafted free agents. As you said, Angelo is the best at the time in between those two points. I just find it interesting that GM's have trouble in certain rounds, but do very well in others-it would seem to defy sense (I mean, a good talent evaluator should be a good talent evaluator all the way through) but it definitely happens. I think there are different skills involved. And a lot depends on how your system works. Some systems require star caliber offensive players, which you need to get early. The Bears defense needs fast guys who can hit, but aside from one or two positions, they don't really need stars. I couldnt agree more. It seems that the GM's that are better at drafting higher round picks like Polian(great example) or AJ Smith are better at evaluating overall talent, while great late round GM like Angelo or Ron Wolf, understand the archetype of each position and find players that fit that mold.

Was there any doubt? He was the shoe-in since this time last year. Tucker, Oden, Neitzel, Haluska on coaches and media's first team. Mike Conley Jr. on one, Geary Claxton on the other. DJ White on 2nd team in both. Rod Wilmont 3rd team on both. You would think so, but the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel made it seem like he and oden were neck and neck. http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=573316

Man I wish we had more picks for the simple fact that I dont think there is a better GM, right now, in the league at drafting mid round talent.

ALANDO TUCKER IS BIG TEN PLAYER OF THE YEAR!!!!!! NOW ON TO THE NAISMITH!!!

:wall: My counter argument is that DVOA is one statistic that cannot be used on its own to determine a running backs worth!!! I never said it was hard to believe or impossible or ANYTHING of that nature to say Benson had a better season. You said Benson was better than Jones. Period. I said prove it. You gave me one statistic. Jones had a higher DPAR then Benson also. I didn't bring it up because DPAR is skewed towards those running backs with more carries. But DVOA is skewed towards who have less carries also. Which statistic is better? Football outsiders have the backs ranked according to DPAR, maybe that tells us something. Or I could phrase it another way. Say Benson had as many carries as Jones and visa versa. Who is to say that Jones wouldnt have a higher DVOA as a result. He has less chances to lessen his value. Just like if Benson had more carries, his DPAR might go up. But to sum it all up nicely. IM NOT EVEN DISAGREEING WITH YOU!!! This is a classic case of production vs. potential, which I guess is my ULTIMATE point. You are going to get the one group of people like you Kaiser who believe Benson has higher ceiling, and the other group like me that recognize the stability and production of Jones. Im satisfied with the trade for Jones, and I think Benson, and to and even greater extent Benson/Peterson will do just fine in 07. You just didnt "prove it".

Prove it! How is Benson a step up from Jones? Success rates were similar last year, but Benson had higher DVOA. I also think Benson is in the "improving" category while Jones' production may be stagnant or declining. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/rb.php Football sabermetrics for the win! Benson had a higher DVOA then these running backs as well: Larry Johnson, Tiki Barber, Steven Jackson, and Frank Gore. You think Kansas City will trade LJ for Ced Benson. Maybe we can get a pick from them also? DVOA only tells part of the story, albeit a compelling one. BTW I Love them both, and im excited for Benson to get 260 plus carries. Way to miss the entire point. Albert Pujols is slightly better than Derrek Lee, should we trade for Albert Pujols immediately? Just because someone is marginally better than someone else doesn't mean they need to be replaced immediately. All KaiserCesar was saying was that the loss of Thomas Jones wasn't a big deal because Benson is more than capable of playing just as well, if not better. Benson certainly didn't get as many carries as those other backs, so he might be suffering from "low sample size syndrome" Another recent sufferer is Matt Murton from 2005. I didnt miss the entire point at all!!! So he brought up DVOA as the way to prove that Benson is a "step up actually". I brought up those other backs to show that DVOA is a statistic that by itself does not illustrate a backs worth. DVOA is actually skewed to favor a back who hasn't had as many carries. Wheras DPAR, which Jones is ranked higher, is skewed to those who have more carries. I bolded your first paragraph to show that actually you missed the entire point of what I was illustrating. This paragraph makes no sense. I was saying that since Benson has a HIGHER DVOA than Larry Johnson, using Kaiser's criteria of the value of a running back, you would think the Chiefs would be excited to trade for Benson. It is a ridiculous statement. Absolutely, but its ridiculous because DVOA is not the end all be all measurement of the running backs worth. How is Pujols for Lee, relevant? If Lee had a higher Value over replacement(which he doesnt) than Pujols, then I guess you could make the analogy to my example by saying: "STL should trade Pujols for DLEE straight up." But how you phrased it, does not apply to my analogy. Instead of disagreeing with him outright that Benson is ALREADY a step up from Jones. I wanted to hear why he thought that. I didnt mention once what I thought until the second post. You could have read that and saved yourself trouble. [/b]

Prove it! How is Benson a step up from Jones? Success rates were similar last year, but Benson had higher DVOA. I also think Benson is in the "improving" category while Jones' production may be stagnant or declining. http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/rb.php Football sabermetrics for the win! Benson had a higher DVOA then these running backs as well: Larry Johnson, Tiki Barber, Steven Jackson, and Frank Gore. You think Kansas City will trade LJ for Ced Benson. Maybe we can get a pick from them also? DVOA only tells part of the story, albeit a compelling one. BTW I Love them both, and im excited for Benson to get 260 plus carries.

If the Bears find a way to trade up and get Quinn, no matter what I'm happy. We have a quarterback. :D

Prove it! How is Benson a step up from Jones?

Wood looks like he is 17

Thompson misses out on another RB...now there's rumors that we're talking to Detroit for Tatum Bell. Ugh. Supposedly we asked if the Bears were trading Thomas Jones, but he's reportedly "off-limits." Of course, that's probably only because Angelo doesn't want to trade him to a team within the division. And it looks like the Patriots are interested in the Moss bidding now as well. Ted needs to get off his ass and start making some moves. Heck, I'd love to see Thomas Jones on the Packers. With his stuttering step and constant looking for cut-backs, the Bears speedy defense would eat him up for dinner. Is that before or after he runs for 80-100 yards, 2 tds, and catches 5 passes? Id rather eat glass then trade Jones to the Packers.

PFT thinks that this trade puts the Bears in good position to trade up. They mentioned Greg Olson as a target. Id would rather sign someone like Randy McMichael and keep the picks. Whether that is feasible, I don't know. I like the idea of Pauly P. and the Sears kid from Tennessee. BTW Dallas signed Brad Johnson

This is sad. Now that I look at the draft pick value chart, im pleased with the deal. Im just sad because you can get anymore solid a rb then T-Jones. I hope that man gets paid!!!!! I will root for the Jets just for him(and the fact I dont care for the rest of the AFC East).

Conditional Pick with this trade is fine. As is, im a little disapointed.

so its 2-0 right now?

Quiet You!!!

It's his first start in spring training after having two years of injuries. I'd expect that he'd be a little rusty agreed I hope that is the case, but it looks a whole lot like last year.

Denver signed Travis Henry. Great Move by the Broncos, Henry had an awesome year last year, and will go bananas with Denver knee killing offensive line.

If teams know we're desperate to unload him, a 1st rounder will be out of the question. I think that's the problem. Angelo has to appear strong -- like he's perfectly willing to let Briggs sit all year if necessary. Otherwise he'll look desperate and teams will try to fleece Briggs away. I'm still not sure the exact value Briggs brought to this ballclub. He's playing right next to a Hall of Famer in the prime of his career, was a 3rd round pick, played for THE premiere linebacker franchise in the NFL. I mean if there's one thing the Bears can do, it's turn a bag of bones into a solid linebacker. Just look at what we did with Hillenmeyer. Drew Rosenhaus..... This is all his fault!!! :jocolor: I just dont understand how a long term agreement cant be reached. We know what Adalias Thomas got, why cant they formulate a contract around that?

EYRE SUPPLY= GENIUS!!!! Carlos Marmol= Carmol Alfonso Soriano= Fozie Bear

dp baby