USSoccer

I think it's pretty speculative for Stone to say the Red Sox "didn't like" Murton. Perhaps they just did what they felt they needed to do to achieve a short-term goal: finishing a huge deal that put pieces in place that were considered necessary to contend for a World Series. And that short-term goal worked out pretty well. I like Murton for the future because he's so outside the mold of the "typical" Cubs hitter. I could actually see him being sort of Grace-esque in the future at the plate; contact hitter for average, good amount of walks, lots of doubles, power numbers are gravy. Maybe (?) we'll find out some day for sure. You'll probably never know exactly what the Red Sox thought about Murton for sure. He's not Babe Ruth or anything, but he has a nice approach at the plate and he swings at good pitches. I've enjoyed watching him, although it's been in very small samples. I'd like see what Murton can do against right handed pitching. All this talk about Murton being the next Mark Grace is premature. He's mostly facing lefties. With Burnitz really slumping, Baker should give Murton a few more starts in left, with Lawton in right. Burnitz could be out of gas. Just for clarification, I never said Murton was the next Mark Grace. But he has an approach to hitting similar in ways to Grace's, which in itself was quite dissimilar from that of most Cubs of, oh, the last 2 decades. I of course agree that Baker should start Murton more consistently, and should have been starting him ever since Hairston got hurt, and some before then. (You don't know if you've got a Rookie of the Year unless you play a rookie.) But of course we all know this isn't going to happen. I'll give Baker some credit on Murton. He's put him in situations where he's at an advantage. Murton came up from Double A, so you don't want to throw him in the middle of the water right away. People can scoff at this, but Baker was a major league hitter and knows a little something about hitting. The flaw in that logic is that Murton hit left and right handed pitchers in AA with equal success. Given how bad our OF was over the last week, there's no reason for him to have had 3 AB's against PHI and NYM.

Stone's act is wearing thin in my world. For one thing, much too much is being made of Aramis' "laziness". He's frickin hurt. How smart would it be for him to run flat out hard to 1B on an easy groundout, when he could easily be lost completely with one tweak? In my world, that would be pretty dumb. And don't give me the argument of "if he's so hurt, why is he playing"? If you call out players like Wood and Prior for not playing through pain, you have no right to carp about Aramis trying to gut it out for the benefit of the team. It's sooooo easy to rip on guys for not hustling, but the fact of the matter is that if the team weren't tanking right now, no one would care. Aramis ran the same way when we were winning as he does now, so what's the difference? Does Stone need a scapegoat for his sour grapes? Second, so what if Boston traded him? They weren't projecting openings in the corner OF spots for a few years, so they had no need for him. SO just because the guy doesn't hit the ball 500 feet, he has no value? Does Stone not realize that command of the zone is more immprtant than raw power for a young playeR? Power comes with time; Murton has skills that aren't easily taught. Just ask Corey Patterson how easy it is to learn plate discipline. Another thing: Why on earth would you call up Pie this year? There's no point in it. Let him recover from his ankle, continue and finish his year up in AA. Why start his option clock now, when it's no benefit to either party? Pie has the same plate discipline issues Patterson has, so why call him up now before he's refined? Impatience? Will Baker even bother to play him? The only intelligent thing he said was that Wood should be shut down and get scoped now to be ready for 2006. But I'm sick to death of him being critical for the sake of it. His analysis lacks insight, and his snide remarks just smack of sour grapes. Strangely enough, another excerpt from today's Sun-Times: That blurb is a far cry from the shots he and the Score hosts have been taking at ARam's lack of "hustle" or "heart". It's not right to speak the Sun Times blurb out of one corner of your mouth while questioning his committment out of the other.

Analyzing a situation doesn't mean you take cheap shots when not warranted, and it also means that you think critically, not be critical. Thinking critically, you would say that Aramis is playing through pain and thus shouldn't be expected to run flat out to 1B on a ground ball to third. His bat is more important that making it a close play, given the risk. Critical thinking tells you that Murton has command of the zone, and thus could be a valuable ML player, and at the very least is the best option in the OF right now when put against Holla and Macias. Critical thinking tells you that it's stupid to call up a guy who's missed 9 weeks with a bad ankle injury just for the sake of it. Critical thinking. Not just criticism. I realize that one makes for better talk radio, but I'm tired of people taking Stone's word for gospel. It's not, and it's seeming more and more obvious that he has a big axe to grind with this organization.

Stone's act is wearing thin in my world. For one thing, much too much is being made of Aramis' "laziness". He's frickin hurt. How smart would it be for him to run flat out hard to 1B on an easy groundout, when he could easily be lost completely with one tweak? In my world, that would be pretty dumb. And don't give me the argument of "if he's so hurt, why is he playing"? If you call out players like Wood and Prior for not playing through pain, you have no right to carp about Aramis trying to gut it out for the benefit of the team. It's sooooo easy to rip on guys for not hustling, but the fact of the matter is that if the team weren't tanking right now, no one would care. Aramis ran the same way when we were winning as he does now, so what's the difference? Does Stone need a scapegoat for his sour grapes? Second, so what if Boston traded him? They weren't projecting openings in the corner OF spots for a few years, so they had no need for him. SO just because the guy doesn't hit the ball 500 feet, he has no value? Does Stone not realize that command of the zone is more immprtant than raw power for a young playeR? Power comes with time; Murton has skills that aren't easily taught. Just ask Corey Patterson how easy it is to learn plate discipline. Another thing: Why on earth would you call up Pie this year? There's no point in it. Let him recover from his ankle, continue and finish his year up in AA. Why start his option clock now, when it's no benefit to either party? Pie has the same plate discipline issues Patterson has, so why call him up now before he's refined? Impatience? Will Baker even bother to play him? The only intelligent thing he said was that Wood should be shut down and get scoped now to be ready for 2006. But I'm sick to death of him being critical for the sake of it. His analysis lacks insight, and his snide remarks just smack of sour grapes.

Is there any doubt Cedeno gets sent down? Now that Nomar is back, he won't see any PT behind Neifi.

They certainly look flat. I said it the other day: I think the Cubs could benifit from a bench clearing brawl....

Single Double Play Pop-Up Single Double Play Pop-Up Single Double Play Pop-Up Repeat x2 "But dude, Macias is hitting .333!! I can't take him out...the guy has saved us.."

Is that like the Moneyball line about 9 Scott Hattebergs being the best lineup in baseball? Would 9 Macias' be the worst?

I would plegde enough money to buy 10 shares if other members were willing to participate in an endeavor. It would actually help the site in many different ways, aside from just giving us a voice as shareholders. We could all be guaranteed Premium membership for a period of time, Tim could possibly expand the site, etc.

It wasn't his only mistake. Try standing behind him for so long to justify his hiring. That is a big mistake. There have been others as well, even if the good outweight the bad. Foolish loyalty gets people fired sometimes. Dick Jauron got fired for not getting rid of an inept offensive coordinator. It would not shock me to see Hendry go down with the ship in this case.

You know it's getting bad when longtime, usually calm posters are screaming bloody murder for Dusty's head. If Bruce Miles is lurking, hopefully he'll continue to take note and apply public pressure to get rid of Dusty. What possible harm could it do the long term health of the franchise to can him now?

You are right, this just seems more painful than other failed seasons. Expectations + talent with a whole lot of mismanaging and poor GM judgement will do that to you.

Unfortunately there isn't going to be much talent to spend that money on this offseason. The free agent pool is pretty pathetic going into this offseason. I could see Hendry pulling off a big trade though for a Dunn, Kearns type player. Of course I'm also hoping that Hendry and Dusty come to an agreement that this team is better off with Dusty somewhere else. If anything, then, overpay some guys for the bullpen for one year rather than giving them their market value for a multiyear deal. Three of those 7 in the bullpen from the original post are horrible (Novoa, Wuertz, Bartosh), and one I've never seen pitch (Brownlie). So with the free agents being as bad as they are, just sign some proven guys to pitch out of the pen for one year, and still have the same amount of money for the next offseason. Worst case scenario, someone we sign that we expect to do good, doesn't, yet there's hardly any risk to it as it's only for one season and he'll be off the books following the season anyway. I don't think Wuertz and Novoa are horrible. Novoa has been decent, and Wuertz gets overused like Farnsworth did. I agree with Vance that the easiest, most logical and best option would be to fire the fool we have managing the team, but I just don't see it happening, unless we really, really tank over the next 50 games.

There was an old thread about "Dusty Proofing" the team. Unfortunatly Hendry does not do anyone any favors, as he's provided Baker with bad alternatives to young, cheap productive players at every turn, full well knowing Baker's managerial tendencies. That said, if Baker is to be back in 2006 the team has to be put together more intelligently than this year's bunch, and I hope pressure mounts from fans and media to do just that. Rip them in the media, rip them at the convention, whatever, just ensure that Baker cannot use anyone as a crutch in 2006 if he must be here. I just don't see the point in having to "Dusty-proof" a team. Often times these aged veterans are great bench options to young players. Their experience helps them in coming off the bench and being ready to play. The problem, as we have all seen, is that Dusty uses them too often and in bad situations when better options are available. I don't want us to have to sacrifice a decent bench so that Dusty can manage this team. The best option is simple and that's to replace the simpleton that's managing this team. if dusty appeared to have a big positive influence on players by bringing us awesome chemistry and tricking crappy guys into playing well and allowing us to bring in guys who are supposedly bad influences who act good with dusty around, it might make sense to do this. however, since none of that stuff happens, it doesn't make sense to acknowledge dusty's shortcomings to the point that you have to structure your roster in weird ways and not just fire him. True, but do you really see Baker being fired?

How do you do it? Can it be done? If you go on the assumption that Baker will indeed be back in 2006, barring some sort of monumental meltdown or epiphany by Hendry, Baker will be here. Given that we've now all seen firsthand over the past 3 seasons the reasons Giants fans loved it when he left, how could we go about constructing a team that Baker couldn't possibly jack up, while keeping the budget within the $85-100m payoll range that is likely in 2006? I'll take the first stab at it. First, the bullpen: Brownlie Bartosh Ohman Wuertz Novoa Dempster Williamson (CL) Brownlie gets to be the long man, and saves us money. Williamson, if healthy would be an excellent closer candidate. Novoa and Dempster would be used in a setup role. Ohman isa good enough LOOGY, Bartosh is the second lefty and Wuertz is middle relief. That bullpen is cheap, has no glaring holes in it, and is beter than throwing money at Brendan Donnelly and BJ Ryan in the offseason. Remember, bullpen guys don't always stay consistently good. See Hawkins, LaTroy. Next, the bench: Blanco Hairston Sweeney Greenberg (5th OF) Grieve Grieve is the backup corner OF, Greenberg the backup CF and speen guy off the bench. Sweeney is the power threat, Hairston takes Macias' role as the 25th man and supersub, and Blanco is the backup catcher. Rotation: Prior Z Wood Hill or Williams Maddux. Provided Maddux does not retire (unlikely), he should be the 5th starter and skipped as often as necessary in the early part of the season, because he does not have very much left in the tank at all. Wood, assuming he gets his shoulder scoped and cleaned out this winter, would be a 3rd starter, and if he's not ready to start at the outset, you could use Wellemeyer or someone from the minors to spot start for him. One of Hill or Williams will be traded in my alternate universe, so whichever is left could be the 4th starter, sicne both are young (Williams younger than Hill, IIRC), both are inexpensive and both have the potential to be solid. In Z and Prior you have a formidable 1-2 punch. Lineup: RF-Lawton LF-Murton 1B-Lee 3B-Ramirez CF-Griffey Jr. (for Williams/Hill, young P, and 40% of his salary) 2B-Walker C-Barrett SS-Cedeno That lineup is relatively balanced, young with one exception, and should have consistent OBP.

I would put any number of posters here in the dugout before Baker. Except CT. :P

There was an old thread about "Dusty Proofing" the team. Unfortunatly Hendry does not do anyone any favors, as he's provided Baker with bad alternatives to young, cheap productive players at every turn, full well knowing Baker's managerial tendencies. That said, if Baker is to be back in 2006 the team has to be put together more intelligently than this year's bunch, and I hope pressure mounts from fans and media to do just that. Rip them in the media, rip them at the convention, whatever, just ensure that Baker cannot use anyone as a crutch in 2006 if he must be here.

Not to mention Wood and Williamson. Aramis played pretty well. 2-4, 1 rbi, 1 run.

and we roll over quietly. this game was doomed after Reyes' easy out popup dropped behind Walker in the first. They looked completely indifferent.

walk.

Great story, and it seems the Reds did the classy thing by keeping the names out of it. Good for them.

What, no polo or badminton stories of your own to share? Ok, big shot. After being an All Conference keeper in middle school, I attended a high school with an established keeper. So, wanting to play immediately, I switched to center midfielder and was pretty good. Anyway, the first game of the playoffs in my senior year, I raced for a loose ball. Their sweeper, a Norwegian exchange student who I battled in an epic 5 set tennis match earlier that year, was going for it also. We struck the ball at nearly the identicle moment. However, a bone on the top of my foot fractured and I went down. The referee, with no medical training, grabbed my foot while I was on the ground. He bent it toward me, asking if it hurt, and I exclaimed, "F#%$ yeah, it hurts!" He then gives me a yellow card! Regardless, we won that game and I attended the next game in a case. The guy replacing me moved up from left fullback. The guy replacing him was a freshman. The freshman tried to clear an in-coming ball about 10 yards out from the goal by one timing it. The ball went of the outside of his foot and spun into the goal. We lost 1-0. Mostly because I broke my foot in the last competitive soccer game I ever played. (While I play some indoor now, its not nearly the same.) Now, one time in badminton, I had this shuttlecock... Haha. Consider yourself lucky, nowadays it's an automatic red for saying the magic word. Of course, it does take quite a bit of non-profane berating to get a card where I played. My freshman debut on varsity, I said "let's keep the gd ball down there" (gd obviously spoken). I got a yellow. 45 seconds into my debut.

What, no polo or badminton stories of your own to share? Ok, big shot. After being an All Conference keeper in middle school, I attended a high school with an established keeper. So, wanting to play immediately, I switched to center midfielder and was pretty good. Anyway, the first game of the playoffs in my senior year, I raced for a loose ball. Their sweeper, a Norwegian exchange student who I battled in an epic 5 set tennis match earlier that year, was going for it also. We struck the ball at nearly the identicle moment. However, a bone on the top of my foot fractured and I went down. The referee, with no medical training, grabbed my foot while I was on the ground. He bent it toward me, asking if it hurt, and I exclaimed, "F#%$ yeah, it hurts!" He then gives me a yellow card! Regardless, we won that game and I attended the next game in a case. The guy replacing me moved up from left fullback. The guy replacing him was a freshman. The freshman tried to clear an in-coming ball about 10 yards out from the goal by one timing it. The ball went of the outside of his foot and spun into the goal. We lost 1-0. Mostly because I broke my foot in the last competitive soccer game I ever played. (While I play some indoor now, its not nearly the same.) Now, one time in badminton, I had this shuttlecock... I was playing semi-pro ball for a team of mostly Guatemalan's a couple years ago, when, during a training scrimage indoors, I planted my ankle, and just about every ligament and tendon snapped. I still can't run too far without pain.

You're right - it's time for me to get off that topic now. It's water under the bridge. It just upsets me that the Cubs had a chance to get this guy twice - after the 2002 season, and again after the 2004 season, and both times couldn't (or wouldn't) close the deal. I don't know how much of a shot this had of happening, but the only non-move that I keep wishing would have happened is signing Tejada a couple years ago. Alex Gonzalez's presence shouldn't have been a determining factor in getting one of the game's best SS. Of course, no Tejada may have meant no Derrek Lee/Choi trade. You're like an angrier JC. You mean goony? Us soccer players must think alike. Must be the shots to the head :D In second to last game this year, I did take a nasty shot to the face. Ouchies! I was wearing a hat, and it broke the brim -- probably saving my nose from being broken. Despite bleeding like a stuck pig, I managed to corral the ball. (Probably because I was bleeding like a stuck pig, the offense let me...) Stupid defense, letting forwards by them for one-on-ones. I hate that. Grrrr. My freshman year in college I was lucky enough to endure 2 concussions. The first one I was run into the post after scoring. The second one I got kicked full force in the back of the head. I also seperated my shoulder on that one. Fun times...

Yeah, here is a thought. Keeping your "criticism muted" is wimp talk for not admitting you didn't have the sack to voice your concerns when things were going well. Your assent to moderator is an abomination. Hilarious. Is this blowback from the Goony comparison? :D BTW, JC, you owe me $4 for dry cleaning. When I read this I spit up diet coke on my shirt. :P I have no idea what you are talking about...or something... Check the other thread, where you called Raw an angrier JC. High comedy. I'm going to go buy wine and drink at my desk. Anyone else want anything while 'm out? You are adept at picking up on a complex, muti-thread, carryover insult, but you completely miss fairly obvious sarcasm? None for me, thanks. I just got back from a "working" lunch with Cpt. Morgan. Yeah...yeah....I miss things here and there... I just went into a meeting with Alice White, btw. Things are going smoothly.