C.C.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/jon_heyman/08/28/al.busts/1.html In the same article, they rank A-rod as the #1 AL disappointment. :roll: I saw this last night...

I was very happy with the Lee quote! It's good to see your team leader stepping up and setting the record straight.

Makes me sick!

I definitely agree with that. Because of the two infield situations we used most often (Walker at second/Mabry at first, or Neifi at second/Walker at first) Lee's at bats would essentially come at the expense of Neifi/Mabry. If replacing one of the worst hitters in the game with one of the best hitters in the game only results in 2-3 extra wins, then how is a bad team ever going to become good? I also agree. And I found it quite strange when Lee went down that so many people flocked to this idea that it wouldn't mean anything. I remember there was some kind of statistical analysis, but come on. At some point common sense must prevail. You don't just pull superstars off a team and say everything is the same. I'm sure someone can put together a stat sheet that shows the Cardinals would be just fine without Pujols, too. That said, Dusty's excuses have become boring. Even if they're correct, nobody wants to hear them anymore. He needs to leave town worse than any Cub manager I can remember, including Lee Elia. He honestly should've been let go at the break. All this stuff is just making him look worse. It's a shame...If he just kept his mouth shut for the last 3 months, he could've walked away with dignity and class. Probably true. Honestly, I can't remember feeling less interest in the Cubs than I do right now. I haven't even been paying attention to Dusty's antics, because it was obvious in May that June, July, August, and September were just going to be more of the same. Once the big losing streak came after Lee went down, and it became clear that Hendry would sit on his butt and do nothing ---- this season became a foregone conclusion. I still watch or pay attention to every game. I can't help it! It's like watching a train wreck...I just can't look away! I watch the games now to watch the young starters...There really is nothing else...

Not only that, but it sounds like they've been leaking stuff to the press trying to make Girardi look bad. The whole deal. Sort of sounds like a nasty situation down there. I like Girardi, but I agree the Cubs should do a full candidate search and not just hire Girardi because of his Chicago history. I totally agree! I hope they take their time and hire the best man. I just don't have too much faith left in Hendry to make the right choice. Man, this Org. is just depressing...

I definitely agree with that. Because of the two infield situations we used most often (Walker at second/Mabry at first, or Neifi at second/Walker at first) Lee's at bats would essentially come at the expense of Neifi/Mabry. If replacing one of the worst hitters in the game with one of the best hitters in the game only results in 2-3 extra wins, then how is a bad team ever going to become good? I also agree. And I found it quite strange when Lee went down that so many people flocked to this idea that it wouldn't mean anything. I remember there was some kind of statistical analysis, but come on. At some point common sense must prevail. You don't just pull superstars off a team and say everything is the same. I'm sure someone can put together a stat sheet that shows the Cardinals would be just fine without Pujols, too. That said, Dusty's excuses have become boring. Even if they're correct, nobody wants to hear them anymore. He needs to leave town worse than any Cub manager I can remember, including Lee Elia. He honestly should've been let go at the break. All this stuff is just making him look worse. It's a shame...If he just kept his mouth shut for the last 3 months, he could've walked away with dignity and class.

Marlins are only 2 games back from the WC now. Wow! I can't see how florida can justify letting go of Girardi?

Good god! I can't wait for Dusty to go! Stop making excuses! :x

Yes. Goony and Fred have hit the nail on the head. CW= conventional wisdom. The ideas that we want clutch hitters, the idea that a speedy guy is needed at the top of the order, sac bunting, walking a hitter to set-up a double play, etc are all examples. I prefer a manager that knows about those things, but has looked at them critically. So are you guys saying Girardi lacks Conventional Wisdom? Whatever the case what he's doing in Florida is pretty damn amazing. Espically for a first year manager. No, I'm saying Giradi relies too much on conventional wisdom. That's what I meant... I don't see enough of his games to see if he does or not. I haven't either...but some of the quotes I've heard seem to be imply he has a strong reliance on it. It's always been my fear ever since people have bandied his name around. Girardi gives me the impression of a manager who would rely on the old adages to a fault. I'm also concerned that if given his way, he could end up with some Dusty-lie veteran fetishes. While he didn't in Florida, he didn't really have the opportunity. Exactly-and every time Girardi's name is brought up, people come up with "He's better than Dusty". Sure, he is-just because he is an upgrade doesn't make him the right man for the job-we could be saying many of the same things about Girardi 3 years from now. Could he be the right hire? Of course-but his Florida experience is closer to managing a minor league team to great things than managing a normal major league team (because it is so full of young players trying to prove themselves instead of potential big ego veterans). There is just so little we know about Girardi and his managerial style with a team like the Cubs that it would be a risk. Well there is little we know about Fredi Gonzalez...larry dierker seems like a popular choice on this board, and I also would'nt mind if he threw his hat in, but does anyone actually know if he wants to manage?

Yes. Goony and Fred have hit the nail on the head. CW= conventional wisdom. The ideas that we want clutch hitters, the idea that a speedy guy is needed at the top of the order, sac bunting, walking a hitter to set-up a double play, etc are all examples. I prefer a manager that knows about those things, but has looked at them critically. So are you guys saying Girardi lacks Conventional Wisdom? Whatever the case what he's doing in Florida is pretty damn amazing. Espically for a first year manager. No, I'm saying Giradi relies too much on conventional wisdom. That's what I meant... I don't see enough of his games to see if he does or not.

Yes. Goony and Fred have hit the nail on the head. CW= conventional wisdom. The ideas that we want clutch hitters, the idea that a speedy guy is needed at the top of the order, sac bunting, walking a hitter to set-up a double play, etc are all examples. I prefer a manager that knows about those things, but has looked at them critically. So are you guys saying Girardi lacks Conventional Wisdom? Whatever the case what he's doing in Florida is pretty damn amazing. Espically for a first year manager.

I don't really understand what it means to know if a guy can manage at the ML level. It's not like it's a skill, like hitting a curve ball. I think far too much importance is given to tenure as a major league manager, that's why so many guys are recycled through the system. I think you are severly oversimplifying things by saying managing is not a skill. Decision making, strategy, knowledge, play relationships, etc all involve skill. No manager search will be needed by your criteria, just pull somebody off of the streets. I said it's not like a skill such as hitting a curveball. I didn't say it took no skill. And I didn't come close to suggesting you could just pull somebody off the streets. I think managers are vastly overrated, and often times do more harm than good. The best managers keep their players in-line and motivated, then sit back and watch them play. It's not like football where designing and calling the right plays can determine the outcome of the season. Some managers are better for really young teams, some are better for extreme veteran teams. Most managers that have had any success, have also had extreme failure. The managers who hurt their team the most are the managers who try to put their signature on every move, looking to "make things happen" by constantly calling for pitchouts (as Dusty often does with pitchers who have control problems), stealing bases, bunting etc. Just keep the egos in check, keep 'em motivated. Rest them and use them properly and it's a fairly simple job, the outcome of which should be determined by the skill of the players on the field. I bet if you ask the top managers if it's that simple, they would laugh! It's not as simple as you think it is.

I don't really understand what it means to know if a guy can manage at the ML level. It's not like it's a skill, like hitting a curve ball. I think far too much importance is given to tenure as a major league manager, that's why so many guys are recycled through the system. It's a different kind of skill. Does he motivate his players, does he have control of the clubhouse etc... For me if it's between Fredi and Joe I'm going for Joe because you can see he has the skills to be a Manager and Fredi is still an unknown. You make it seem anyone can manage a ML team?

The last thing I'm interested in is how big of a name the manager has. I don't want the enthusiasm to be built on the name of the manager, that should be determined by the level of player acquisition Hendry embarks on this winter. I, for one, don't really care about tenure. Whether the next manager is here for 3 years or 10, all I care about is they win. Some managers come in and win one, then leave, as they either wear out their welcome or lose the desire. Joe Torre and Bobby Cox are the only real staples of the managerial business. Scioscia is close with his 6 years and level of success. I really have no interest in getting a guy like Bochy to be there every year and pretty much maintain a level of mediocrity that does little to inspire. Stability is overrated in sports if it doesn't come with success. I'd much rather have a short and volatile era than a long steady, and ultimately unsuccessful period. Agreed. Get me Davey Johnson who will piss everyone off in route to winning 2-3 penants. I'm not opposed to Girardi; however, once again let me state my candidates on order of preference. 1. Dierker 2. Johnson 3. Gonzalez I'd be happy with any of the three. After that, there's a number of names I might be ok with, but I'm not overly excited about. Girardi is in that group. Why would you want Gonzalez over Girardi? Just curious? Gonzalez has had success managing in the minors as well as working with major league teams. I'd hope some of Cox's philosophies would rub off on him as well. I've heard some of the things Girardi has said, and he's filled with a little too much CW for my liking. I'm not saying he'd be a bad choice, and he certainly has done much with little in Florida, but I'd prefer someone less inclined to use CW in their decisions. But Gonzalez has never managed a ML team, so you don't know what you are getting. At least with Girardi you know the man can manage at the ML level, and he's finishing strong even with all the controversy surrounding him. What's CW?

The last thing I'm interested in is how big of a name the manager has. I don't want the enthusiasm to be built on the name of the manager, that should be determined by the level of player acquisition Hendry embarks on this winter. I, for one, don't really care about tenure. Whether the next manager is here for 3 years or 10, all I care about is they win. Some managers come in and win one, then leave, as they either wear out their welcome or lose the desire. Joe Torre and Bobby Cox are the only real staples of the managerial business. Scioscia is close with his 6 years and level of success. I really have no interest in getting a guy like Bochy to be there every year and pretty much maintain a level of mediocrity that does little to inspire. Stability is overrated in sports if it doesn't come with success. I'd much rather have a short and volatile era than a long steady, and ultimately unsuccessful period. Agreed. Get me Davey Johnson who will piss everyone off in route to winning 2-3 penants. I'm not opposed to Girardi; however, once again let me state my candidates on order of preference. 1. Dierker 2. Johnson 3. Gonzalez I'd be happy with any of the three. After that, there's a number of names I might be ok with, but I'm not overly excited about. Girardi is in that group. Why would you want Gonzalez over Girardi? Just curious?

I think it was Mike Greenberg who said something to the effect of "I would be shocked if Girardi isn't managing the Cubs next year, assuming he leaves Florida." I'm not sure how much stock I put into his predictions/analysis. Agreed. Hendry will go through his "interviews" to make it look like he's going through his whole process, the way he did with Melvin, and Showalter, and Garner, and whoever else he interviewed when he had Dusty in his sights the whole time. I imagine Jim already knows what he wants to do, and who he wants to replace Dusty. I just hope that it's not Piniella. Hendry will distance himself from Girardi and any other managerial candidates until the end of the season to lessen the chances for a messy Dusty/Cubs divorce. It's pretty obvious Dusty's gone at this point. His statements about his unhappiness here and not being wanted, whether true or not, will only ease the decision-making process for Hendry. Like many, I'd love to see Girardi in our dugout next year. I'm sure Fredi in Atlanta would be sufficient, but I really want to see 1) a big name that would renew/generate optimism 2) a serious and passionate manager who instills discipline and 3) tenure. Granted, tenure isn't a part of the negotiating process, but I'm sick of the 3-4 yr managerial terms here on the North Side. Joe's connection to the Cubs could enable a longer stay here - of course, so could anyone who understands that Neifi should never bat 2nd or have more than a handful of plate appearances, reluctance to respect OBP... I'm not going to list more of Dusty's mind-boggling decisions. At this point it doesn' t bear repeating unless he's brought back. It's a no-brainer to go get Girardi, which means we'll end up with Jimmy Williams or Bochy.

The Northside is still considered an attractive place to play because the expectations are low and the adoration (unless you're awful) is high. Also, there's plenty of extra money to be made through local advertising, personal appearances, etc. Finally, contrary to all of the excuse-makers, I think quite a few players enjoy the day baseball and having a regular relationship with their families. You don't hear too many players who don't like to play in Wrigley Field. It'll always be attractive place for players...And the added bonus of if the Cubs do win a WS that team will be adored forever. Heck, the 1984 team is still worshiped!

If it weren't for the late season injury to Flash Gordon I think they would have likely made the playoffs that year. Seems hilarious now, but I recall the elation I felt knowing that we had locked up the division with the McGriff trade. I recall a decisive beatdown on the Cardinals that very weekend that further cemented the notion. The thing I didn't like about that trade was they were replacing one of the three productive bats in the lineup with a guy who was just a little more productive. It's not like they plugged a whole. Stairs was hitting, unlike a lot of the other guys. Well that and he didn't want to come here. He wanted to stay in Tampa...Rmemeber it took him at least a week to make up his mind to come to chicago?

You wanna bet that the Marlins will win another championship (thier 3rd) before us? That's such a joke that the Marlins and Dbacks have recently won and one of the oldest and most cherished franchises haven't won in almost 100 years. It has nothing to do with stupid curses, just stupid management! Pisses me off!

Compare those decisions to starting Neifi at 2nd Base and batting him 2nd, letting pitchers throw 120+ pitches in a game, etc. Great reply! And so true!

Reports out of NY is that girardi will be let go at the end of the season and the Marlins are going to target Fredi Gonzalez as the next manager. I think that girardi will be the next manager of the Cubs. It just feels right...

I was one Hill's non-supporters. I'm eating crow now and have no problem doing so. He's looked like a ML pitcher out there the past month. The one postive today was the 2 k's and yet he got the job done. That has to bold well for his learning process and mental approach that he doesn't have to K guys to be effective. I hope he keeps it up. It'll be nice to know we have at least two pitchers (Z and Hill) to work with for next year. what about mateo, guzman & marshall? Gooz has only had 1 good start and he needs to stay healthy. He's not someone you can count on. Marshall is coming off a injury and Mateo needs more starts under his belt. We will see if they can step it up for the last month of the season...

I was one Hill's non-supporters. I'm eating crow now and have no problem doing so. He's looked like a ML pitcher out there the past month. The one postive today was the 2 k's and yet he got the job done. That has to bold well for his learning process and mental approach that he doesn't have to K guys to be effective. I hope he keeps it up. It'll be nice to know we have at least two pitchers (Z and Hill) to work with for next year.

I love KingPin! "Sweetie when you come back can you scrape the perfume before you come back here."

I don't care if the trib paid off the other teams to lose vs. us! Give us a ring dammit!!!!