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wooooosh your post seemed pretty sincere and other than the snaggle tooth, she looked good in that picture

is this is a competition of who made the most stupid plays? i think cedeno would blow the competition away if so. I think he was being sarcastic and saying that throwing errors don't mean a player is being dumb We are all arguing degree of deficiency here. Some say "idiotic", some say "dumb", some say "not the smartest"...... Its all a matter of the adjective that you want to use. And how many players in professional sports actually get thrown out sliding past second base on a walk? I'm guessing the odds of it happening during a ballgame are pretty astronomical. And then to admit that you didn't know there was a rule that you couldn't pass 2nd base? That is getting into Michael Barrett territory. In regard to Bruce, pointing out one of many "insert adjective for Cedeno's deficiency" mistakes over the course of his time with the Cubs isn't piling on. Piling on would be if he took the time to list multiple instances. I don't get the Barrett reference

Jewel is kinda is/was hot, but damn dude you picked a horrible picture to make that argument with

is this is a competition of who made the most stupid plays? i think cedeno would blow the competition away if so. I think he was being sarcastic and saying that throwing errors don't mean a player is being dumb

i love how people make that "thrown out at 2nd base on a walk" thing into some completely idiotic move. didn't he just overslide the bag or something? oversliding the bag isn't idiotic? It was a mistake. It happens more than people let on. I don't really see how it's "idiotic". i think it's pretty stupid. if you think about it, he's got about a 7 foot span to stop himself and still be on the bag. just one of the many stupid thing he did during his time here. i'll always remember him firing balls into the first few rows behind the visitor's dugout. That's another thing that's not "idiotic". It's not like he was like "wait should i throw it to Lee... or into the stands? I think I'm supposed to throw it in the stands." It was a throwing error. It had nothing to do with being an idiot I think he was definitely a dumb player, but it seems like there is a lot of piling on

i love how people make that "thrown out at 2nd base on a walk" thing into some completely idiotic move. didn't he just overslide the bag or something? oversliding the bag isn't idiotic? Because it was a 3-2 count with 2 outs there is no need to slide because 1. The batter makes an out either a ball in play or K, inning over 2. The batter walks, he moves to second and even if their is a throw that beats him he is still safe 3. The batter fouls off a pitch, he goes back to first 4. The batter gets a hit, in which case sliding into second is completely idiotic because he could potentially advance to 3B or even score if he stays on his feet and sees where the ball is going Was it really a 3-2 count with 2 outs? I don't remember. Why did the catcher even throw it then?

There's a difference between dancing around a topic and coming out and refuting it heavily

i love how people make that "thrown out at 2nd base on a walk" thing into some completely idiotic move. didn't he just overslide the bag or something? Yep, so they're not even right. He was thrown out going from 2nd to 3rd. At least Ryan Theriot is a smart baserunner. i thought the "Theriot is a smart baserunner" stuff stopped after last season when he made numerous baserunning blunders (and I'm not even talking about CS)

i love how people make that "thrown out at 2nd base on a walk" thing into some completely idiotic move. didn't he just overslide the bag or something? oversliding the bag isn't idiotic? It was a mistake. It happens more than people let on. I don't really see how it's "idiotic".

We know the Padres liked Olson and offered Khalil Greene for him. But that doesn't mean the Padres love Olson or anything like that. When you factor in what the Padres ended up getting for Greene, Olson would have been a good trade for them. But thinking Olson was a main piece in a deal, is also kinda guessing. Sean Marshall probably has more value then Olson, and Gaudin probably has simliar. I don't see how Olson is this great piece that needs to be on the team to get Peavy. Of course following rumors all offseason we would think so. But nobody knows for sure if Pie for Olson trade was made for a Peavy deal. Wait, what? Where did I ever say anything about Olson being a main piece in the trade? The only reason I mentioned his name was to show the difference between a player who we know interests Towers (he ever repeated it a few days ago) and a player who "might be involved" based on speculation of some writers who don't really know. I was referring to the "the guys acquired for DeRosa will presumably be shipped for peavy". There's no reason to presume that at all.

I have, he with Kevin Hart, Vitters and Olson were the main names I heard. We've heard spculation about what the Padres might want, which is basically just a guess. How many names have we actually heard mentioned, and how many of those are the Padres actually interested in? It's all just guessing and even making things up. We know they were interested in Olson. We have no idea if they were interested in Stevens.

Are people talking about the team collapsing? I haven't seen that. The Cubs have made a million moves without getting any better or positioning themselves to be better in the future. That's frustrating. There were some posts a few pages back saying that Hendry is going to be surprised that his team is a couple games over .500 halfway through the season. I agree its frustrating though. Obviously I was being kind of sarcastic, but would it really be a surprise if that ended up being true? I think most people has us at 85-90 wins right now. If we catch a few bad breaks it's not that crazy to think that they could be only slightly above average

I don't see how Hendry has earned the right to be given the benefit of the doubt this offseason. Also, whether ot nor he makes other moves doesn't really excuse some of the other dumb things he's done. Getting as little as he did for DeRosa is basd. Giving Miles the contract he did is bad. Giving Bradley what he didis bad. Trading Cedeno and Olson for Heilman is bad. Those are bad moves, regardless of what follows them. What he got for DeRosa was pitching prospects which presumably will lead to Peavy. Who knows how the contracts to Miles and Bradley will work out? Waiting for their prices to go down might have resulted in them signing with another team and then posters would jump all over Hendry for not signing them. On the surface, the Cedeno + Olsen for Heilman deal doesn't look great, but Olson's strongest traits were that he had an option left and it was rumored that the Padres wanted him in a Peavy deal. He has been a terrible major league pitcher. I'm not defending any of the moves Hendry has made, but none of us are fully aware of what's happening financially with the Cubs and other clubs and what kinds of discussions are going on with other GMs. That's why I said we need to wait and see what the final roster looks like. Why are you presuming the guys they got from Cleveland are going in a Peavy trade? Stephens is one of the rumored names in a Peavy deal, but if none of them go to SD they still add to the minor league depth to replace pitching prospects that would be in the deal. I haven't seen anything about Stevens being involved. And yes they add to the system, of course they do. The point was that they weren't a good enough package for the player we traded for them.

Huh? I think you're mixing up Olson with Gregg you're right. my bad :oops: but Olson has not had a stellar career with the exception of his k/bb ratio. minor league career, or major league career?

I don't see how Hendry has earned the right to be given the benefit of the doubt this offseason. Also, whether ot nor he makes other moves doesn't really excuse some of the other dumb things he's done. Getting as little as he did for DeRosa is basd. Giving Miles the contract he did is bad. Giving Bradley what he didis bad. Trading Cedeno and Olson for Heilman is bad. Those are bad moves, regardless of what follows them. What he got for DeRosa was pitching prospects which presumably will lead to Peavy. Who knows how the contracts to Miles and Bradley will work out? Waiting for their prices to go down might have resulted in them signing with another team and then posters would jump all over Hendry for not signing them. On the surface, the Cedeno + Olsen for Heilman deal doesn't look great, but Olson's strongest traits were that he had an option left and it was rumored that the Padres wanted him in a Peavy deal. He has been a terrible major league pitcher. I'm not defending any of the moves Hendry has made, but none of us are fully aware of what's happening financially with the Cubs and other clubs and what kinds of discussions are going on with other GMs. That's why I said we need to wait and see what the final roster looks like. Why are you presuming the guys they got from Cleveland are going in a Peavy trade?

You know that runs allowed doesn't tell the whole story with relievers

It still depends on what else they do, Heilman makes their bullpen better. I would say right now that Gaudin, Guzman, Vizcaino, Wuertz, Heilman, Gregg and Marmol is a better pen then we had last year. Trading one of those relievers seems likely, and we still have money and prospects to get another SP. Adding a SP better then Marquis, having a better bullpen, and swapping DeRosa/Edmonds for Bradley/Fontenot or Miles makes me still believe that this team is better. Everyone just has their heart set on Peavy, but I'll really take any pitcher on a one year deal better then Marquis and be happy. They didn't replace DeRosa with Fontenot. Fontenot was already on the team. And I don't really see how you can say this team is better, especially considering all the flukey production we were going to lose even if we kept the same team

Ronny Cedeno has very little value, the Cubs would be lucky to get a mediocre minor league reliever for him. I knew from day one that the Cubs weren't gonna get Cedeno for Heilman straight up. Olson obviously is the guy with the value in this trade, but I don't think he has a ton of value either. People are just pissed off because they thought Olson was part of a Peavy deal. But nobody ever said we had to have Olson to get Peavy. Not true. People are pissed because this is a bad trade and a waste of resources.

Huh? I think you're mixing up Olson with Gregg

Heilman is a dime a dozen reliever who does nothing particularly well. yeah, thats not true. its already been shown that he's very effective against right handed hitters. Didn't you just call him a "terrible swingman"?

I don't see how Hendry has earned the right to be given the benefit of the doubt this offseason. Also, whether ot nor he makes other moves doesn't really excuse some of the other dumb things he's done. Getting as little as he did for DeRosa is basd. Giving Miles the contract he did is bad. Giving Bradley what he didis bad. Trading Cedeno and Olson for Heilman is bad. Those are bad moves, regardless of what follows them. that's awfully myopic. one man's trash is another's treasure. if the "little" he got for dero turns around and nets something better than dero, that's a good trade. etc. Okay let's pretend for a second that these most recent trades are setting up for something bigger (which seems pretty unlikely What about the Miles signing? The Bradley signing? Ceda for Gregg? Not offering Wood arbitration? Dempster's contract? None of those things are leading to anything else.

I thought it was kind of naive to begin with

I don't see how Hendry has earned the right to be given the benefit of the doubt this offseason. Also, whether ot nor he makes other moves doesn't really excuse some of the other dumb things he's done. Getting as little as he did for DeRosa is basd. Giving Miles the contract he did is bad. Giving Bradley what he didis bad. Trading Cedeno and Olson for Heilman is bad. Those are bad moves, regardless of what follows them.

We really need Bruce to weigh in and tell us WTF is going on, since he has been saying that Hendry will go hard after Peavy as soon as he has the go ahead from ownership. SO what has changed? Either the Padres are no longer shopping Peavy, the Cubs are no longer interested in Peavy, or the Padres are no longer interested in Olson. Which is it?

It's funny how over the past couple season Hendry was actually making a lot of good moves and people that doubted him (me) were starting to think "maybe he's not really that bad". It seems like this offseason he's trying as hard as he can to erase everything good he's done over the past couple years... like he's on a mission to prove once and for all that he really is bad. Well played Jim.