hitamprun

I think both Hawk and Stone bring a unique perspective to the game because of their knowledge, and that can be interesting to listen to. One thing that always irritated me about them both is their arrogance, both would do well with a slight dose of humility.

I think Pat is technically a very good announcer. He does what a radio guy should do, he paints a pitcture to give you an idea of what is happening. He also has an easy voice to listen to. Santo is another story. I understand the nostalga of having him in the booth, and it does create a unique atmosphere. Pat also does an excellent job working around Santo, and keeping the broadcast moving along. At times, I have a hard time listening to Santo for very long, it just gets a bit painful. Some of you may remember Vince Lloyd, who broadcast on the radio for the Cubs with Lou Beadrou. Lloyd was another excellent technical guy who worked very well with Lou. Lou did not come across as a sharp radio man, but he knew the game exceptionally well.

Nope. The dude playing with his nipples was much more interesting. I've also noticed that... i wonder why its a bit more closed now?.. I think Lee is going through the normal adjustment phase of adapting how pitchers are throwing to him. Going into 05, the book on him was you could bust him inside and tie him up. He opened his stance, and started to get around on the inside pitch and was killing it. Word gets around, and they start pitching him outside, which requires him to close it up a bit to have plate coverage on that pitch. These guys are constantly tweaking, to be better prepared for how opposing teams are pitching to them.

Just turned it on, was he already on?

Had the pleasure of meeting Dr. Andrews a few times, and he is a hell of a nice guy, and a great orthopedist. Yokum will compare notes with Andrews on his physical exam and probably compare MRI's to see if there is any significant change. I would bet nothing much of any significance is going to come out of this except - he has some irriation in his shoulder.

I'll bet they find nothing that calls for surgery. But, whether he gets the knife or not, do you really want another year of this soap opera???

and apparently you think the answer is manliness. I believe the mound was lowered in 68, so anyone past that time, was throwing from the same height. Also, there were plenty of fireballers during that era, and pitching to lesser hitters? Strongly disagree there, the league was not as watered down, and players were more seasoned. You had more baseball players vs the beefed up one dimensional players you have today. It's true, some players are tougher than others, and anyone can form an opinion as to who are the tough ones. It's not so much these guys were tougher, but how they prepared, and what their expectations were. I have no clue whether Prior juiced, but steriods has played a role in injuries, as has improper weight training that creates all kinks of imbalances in the shoulder area. No, more like - preparedness! Pitchers today, don't prepare like they did in the 60's and 70's when they threw more innings, had less rest, more double headers, 4 man rotations and threw more pitches. Prior has come up lame in 4 straight spring trainings, after 5 months of rest and time to PREPARE. Does anybody else wonder, what the hell does this guy do in the offseason??? Pitchers in the 60's and 70's had a higher mound, faced weaker hitters much more often, could throw inside to hitters who weren't as quick and didn't have armor on, didn't have to face power hitters like today, who may or may not be on performance enhancing drugs, had bigger ballparks with which to pitch in, and didn't throw as hard or with as much tourque. But yeah, man, they were TOUGHER.

and apparently you think the answer is manliness. No, more like - preparedness! Pitchers today, don't prepare like they did in the 60's and 70's when they threw more innings, had less rest, more double headers, 4 man rotations and threw more pitches. Prior has come up lame in 4 straight spring trainings, after 5 months of rest and time to PREPARE. Does anybody else wonder, what the hell does this guy do in the offseason???

High stress innings?????? WTF!!!!!! I've heard it all now. Maybe MLB should come up with a rule that all starters have to be pulled when they reach 100 pitches. Also, they could set another rule that caps out pitches thrown per week, per month etc. It wouldn't make a bit of difference, you would still see the same amount of injuries, because the pitchers today don't throw as much as then those of the past, yet they get hurt more. Pitch count is not the answer, you need to look elswhere.

Please provide an example of these "many pitchers" that had similar loads. Remember, we aren't talking IP, we're talking pitches. Every pitcher in the 1960s? if you think every pitcher in the 1960's threw as hard with as much torque on their arms as Wood and Prior you are truly fooling yourself theres also little evidence to support that more pitches cause more injuries. lets be frank, those 120 pitches are far from the only movements the arm does over the course of the season. When you look at bullpens (even when theyre at say 85%), all the long toss sessions, all the arm strengthening routines and everything else, those additional 10 pitches each start represent less than say 1% of all the motion the arm goes through. 30-40 years ago, your top 2-3 starters regularly threw 300+ innings on 3 days rest and usually completed 20+ games. How many pitches do you think strike out pitchers like Bob Gibson, Tom Seaver, Sandy Koufax threw with 20+ complete games? Pitch count is something to look at, but it is entirely overblown. I don't know if anyone has every heard Fergie Jenkins talk about pitch counts, how often he threw etc., but it is very enlightning and was typical in his day.

For the same injury that Wood had in 2005. You disagree with BP's assessment, fine. But respond to the whole post. I believe I did. Prior never had the same diagnosis as Wood, and surgery was never an option that came from several different opinions. They have never found anything (to date) that required surgery, and this has been confirmed over and over again.

They have yet to come up with an exact science into the mysteries of abuse of a pitching arm. How much can an MRI detect? Does it show nerve damage? It very well could just be coincidental that the youngest pitcher with the most pitcher abuse points hasn't been right ever since. But, the evidence is there that suggests that it wasn't just coincidental. You can toss it out there that the likelihood that the pitching abuse points in 2003 had nothing to do with what's wrong with Prior now, but it doesn't make your point any more correct than anyone elses. Again, you are assuming the correlation and that's fine. I am looking at another correlation, and also don't think it is a coincidence he has not shown any structural damage to date, and it doesn't jive with the damage from abuse theory. Let's just agree to disagree on this one.

The abuse didn't stop in 2003. Ok. But you are drawing a conclusion based on number of pitches thrown, and are assuming damage was done. I am drawing a conclusion based on the fact no MRI, or physician has found any structural damage with Prior. My question is simple - if abuse has caused Prior's problems, why haven't the best physcians in the US, found any damage to account for his problems since 04. Does anyone remember the game he pitched in 05? He pitched about 2 innings, and called the trainer out to the mound, and pulled himself from the game because he had discomfort. Everyone was expecting the worst, because you rarely see a pitcher call out a trainer and yank himself. He was examined by the docs and had an MRI the next day, and every came back 100% clean. Low and behold, he didn't miss his next start. I say this for one reason, it gives you a general idea of how Prior percieves discomfort, and how it continues to effect him today. You really have to look at the complete picture here, not just how many pitches he threw in a select amount of his games.

Seriously, your argument is just wrong on so many levels. If you want to ignore mountains of evidence that Mark Prior and Kerry Wood were broken beyond repair in 2003, knock yourself out. Ok, let's assume your are correct. Prior was signficantly damaged by the 2003 season. I think we would agree the damage was significant, because he has failed to make it out of 4 straight spring trainings and has had several trips to the DL. Now, I know a little about sportsmedicine, because I have been in that field for 15 years, and I know what diagnostic tests and orthopaedic dr's are capable of finding. If Prior had something going on, that was significant enouph to cause his past 4 years of history, it is incredibly unlikely, he would have had a clean structural bill of health from numerous MRI's and many different physicians, time and time again. That's why I don't believe in the lingering effect of 03 abuse theory. Anything causing him so much trouble, is not going undectable for this long.

What happens a lot of times is a potential buying group will find out through the grapevine, you have little chance. The Red Sox did not go to the highest bidder for this reason, and some may remember the former owner of the 49r's wanted to buy the Sox from Bill Veek before Reinsdorf, and he was shot down.

It's not the amount of innings, but the amount of pitches. In 2003, Prior ranked third in Pitcher Abuse Points. Want to know who was first? That's right, Kerry Wood! And that was through September. It doesn't include Prior's post season starts that further put strain on his arm. You can read about pitcher abuse points here. So, it's much more than innings pitched. It's the way those innings were accumulated and the amount of pitches in those innings. Ok, let's go down that path. He has basically had one year when he pitched several games of 100+ pitches. Do you recall him going into the offseason in 03 with any significant injury? He pitched in October with no problem, and then had 5 months to rest. There was not a single event in which he blew out his arm, nor has any dr or diagnostic exam found anything structurally wrong, so where is the damage? If he was damaged by 03, why haven't they found anything of any significance over the last few years? There have been many pitchers who have had similar loads that Prior and Wood (for only one season) and did not fold up like a cardboard box. Wood, is a different story, his mechanics have caused big time issues, and he has caused damage over time. Prior, is another deal, and I don't buy 03 ruined him, and if it somehow did, he doesn't have the physical capability to hold up as a starter.

Well, after years of MRI's and visiting a myriad of dr's, they haven't found anything structural to fix. What are they supposed to do, make something up, so he can have surgery? BP's annual book said that Prior's injury was the same one Wood had in 2005. If you recall, Wood was OK last year early in his first few starts. That was after surgery. Then he lost it. Then Wood tried rehab without surgery and the jury is still out. I suspect that Prior has had it with this routine the last few years and will take the surgical option. The Cubs won't mind because it will add one year to the control period. While Wood postponed his surgery for the 2005 playoff "run," I think Prior will opt for surgery as soon as possible. His prognosis should be better than Wood's just because Wood's mechanics are so horrible. The better model might be Matt Morris who had the same surgery, was brought along slowly, then became serviceable. I would hope that Prior would be more than that because he was better than Morris. Can't have a Prior post without a helping of "hope." Prior did not have the same injury as Wood, he was diagnosed with a loose shoulder, which is quite common among pitchers. You say he would take the surgery route, surgery for what ailment exactly?

That's quite a stretch. Am I the only one who sees a pattern here? Tell me why a young pitcher, can't make it out of ST for four straight seasons ready to pitch in a big league game? Every year, he has had 5 months to rest, rehab, strengthen whatever, and he still can't get ready. How do the other guys do it? Please don't tell me he was overused by Dusty, that is the lamest excuse I have ever heard, and was 4 years ago. There are many pitchers, that have pitched 200+ innings year after year, and he has only done it once. This guy is missing something, and it isn't talent, but talent doesn't matter if you can't take the ball. He was overused by Dusty. Really overused. Then your saying one year of 211 innings fried this guy? If that is the case, he was not meant to be a starting pitcher in the bigs. It wasn't that long ago, starting pitchers would pitch every 4th day, compile 300+ innings per year, and complete 20+ games per year. Today, if you throw 200+, and have 4-5 complete games, you are abused.

Well, after years of MRI's and visiting a myriad of dr's, they haven't found anything structural to fix. What are they supposed to do, make something up, so he can have surgery?

That's quite a stretch. Am I the only one who sees a pattern here? Tell me why a young pitcher, can't make it out of ST for four straight seasons ready to pitch in a big league game? Every year, he has had 5 months to rest, rehab, strengthen whatever, and he still can't get ready. How do the other guys do it? Please don't tell me he was overused by Dusty, that is the lamest excuse I have ever heard, and was 4 years ago. There are many pitchers, that have pitched 200+ innings year after year, and he has only done it once. This guy is missing something, and it isn't talent, but talent doesn't matter if you can't take the ball.

Let me go out on a limb here - this guy has had more MRI's and doc visits then some rosters of entire teams. Since 04, they have yet to find a structural problem, and look at how much he has been on the shelf. If he actually needs surgery now (I doubt it), I would estimate his rehab time at about 5 years. I would expect more of the same when he sees Yokum - structurally, everything is intact, but he has some irritation. Prior was not cut out to be a reliable major league pitcher, and we have 4 years of history to prove it. 07, IMO, was his last hurrah with the Cubs, and you can stick a fork in him.

politically, reinsdorf would sabotage him. the whole thing smacks of collusion, because it's a conflict of interest for jerry to have a vote at all, anyway. sadly, he wouldn't need a vote, just a phone and a few friends around the league. I tend to agree with you. Reinsdorf is very very shrewd, and he is one of the most powerful owners behind the scenes. He has Bud in his pocket, and could muster the votes to not allow Cuban into their selective club and he could do it quietly. To be honest, even without Reinsdorf raising hell, I don't see a Cuban type getting the 75% votes anyway. Purchasing a major league franchise is equivalent to joining a private country club, and they can select whomever they choose, no matter how much money they have.

Any why would you have interest in controlling Prior until 09? I have no desire to watch this guy rehab for the next two years.

Another Phil Rogers article. This guy is so all over the map, it's a joke. First he writes the Cubs should hire Razor Shines as their next manager, and then two weeks later he does a 180 and says they should keep Dusty. Who knows what will come next, but you can be assured, the Cubs will need to hire a manager who will be a name that will appease the fan base and send a positive PR message, and I don't think that person is Gonzalez.

I have great respect for what he accomplished in his career, and for what he has endured healthwise. With that said, it can be very painful to listen to him in the booth. The Cubs would never send him on his way because they are scared to death of the PR downfall. He will be in the booth as long as he wants to be, or his health allows him.