Backtobanks

I would think the Dodgers will be sellers now instead of buyers. I can't see a reason for them to want Maddux now that they're sinking fast.

I've been saying all along that I didn't understand the "untouchable" label that Hendry put on Hill in spring training. Back then everyone acted like he was the second coming of Sandy Koufax. I just wonder who the Cubs could have acquired for a package with Hill in it last off season.

And noone in this thread has said anything about giving him away for nothing, we are just saying it is something that should be explored if you can get the right deal, how hard of a concept is that to grasp? Of course, the key words are "if you can get the right deal". Whether it is "the right deal" is what makes all of this speculation so much fun. Also, everyone's opinion of "the right deal" is different and we all worry about the only opinion that counts.....Hendry's.

If those are true, the White Sox could really be in trouble.

Just what the Cubs need, a 1B that they just sent to AAA. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Cubs have a 1B.

Prior and Wood aren't Santana and Liriano. At their best they're close. At their best, they were close.

Amen! Add to that the fact that he hasn't been pitching that well lately. Dempster has always had too many walks as a closer and there was no place to put Lo Duca if he continued his lack of control. You can tell if a relief pitcher (especially a closer) is on or off by watching the first 2 batters. I advocated for years that you have others warming up when you bring in any relief pitcher (including the closer). If that hurts their ego, so be it.

Let's wait until after the trade deadline before we give him a kick in the head.

To potentially plug some of those holes, that's why. Barrett's trade value is likely as high as it will ever be. If dealing him can plug 2 holes and an adequate replacement could be found to take his spot, it would be a great move. I don't get it the Cubs offense stinks and people are suggesting trading Barrett and ARam. Yes, we might get back some decent prospects or even a veteran OF, but you need to take into consideration that it is much harder finding decent replacements at C and 3B than the OF. For the Cubs to consider a trade of ARam or Barrett, they would need to have Cabrera, ARod, or many can't-miss prospects including a 3B and C. You probably don't get it because you're not reading the reasoning. Nobody is advocating trading Barrett or Aramis for "decent prospects or even a veteran OF". Barrett's value is at an all-time high and a deal should be explored if that deal makes the team better overall, plugging other holes as well as finding a suitable replacement behind the plate. If dealing Barrett and getting that talent in return takes this offense from pathetic to tolerable, that's a huge step in the right direction. Aramis should be dealt if there's strong evidence that he will opt out of his contract and go elsewhere. Losing him for nothing would be dumber than any trade we could make. Having said that, there is nobody within the entire Cubs organization that should be 100% off limits. There is nobody in baseball that should be considered untouchable. Any player should be available for the right price. I worry about some posters wanting to make trades just for the sake of making a trade. A lot of these top prospects mentioned make us drool at the thought of getting them, but let's not forget that they're still "prospects". I agree that nobody is untouchable, but it would take a real knock-your-socks-off deal for me to trade Barrett or ARam.

To potentially plug some of those holes, that's why. Barrett's trade value is likely as high as it will ever be. If dealing him can plug 2 holes and an adequate replacement could be found to take his spot, it would be a great move. I don't get it the Cubs offense stinks and people are suggesting trading Barrett and ARam. Yes, we might get back some decent prospects or even a veteran OF, but you need to take into consideration that it is much harder finding decent replacements at C and 3B than the OF. For the Cubs to consider a trade of ARam or Barrett, they would need to have Cabrera, ARod, or many can't-miss prospects including a 3B and C.

Well, if your comment about stat geeks wasn't intended to attack other posters on this board, I don't understand the point, but whatever. As for Walker and Soriano, this year, Soriano has been better. The 2 previous years, Walker was. The 2 years before that? Soriano was better - he had 2 really good years in '02 and '03 (esp 02). But, as others have said, Soriano's contract is based on hype & potential, which he is matching with performance this year. He wasn't doing that in '04 and '05. As for whether Texas would have traded Soriano for Walker last year, I don't know. Do you? Since Hendry worked overtime trying to deal Walker and he really wanted Soriano, I would think that the Rangers would have laughed in Hendry's face at an offer of only Walker. Again the knowledgable people in baseball have traded away Walker and have trouble finding a full time position for him while Soriano has been desired by many of the same people over the years. Can't all be based on hype and potential, but mediocre production.

Troll much? As I posted about 2 pages ago, just b/c people use stats to compare players doesn't mean they don't watch games. Show me one post that says that Walker is having a better 2006 season than Soriano. Just one. Go ahead, I'll wait. Having any luck? I'll give you a few more minutes. Ok, I think that's enough time. No one is arguing that. What people are arguing (quite convincingly) is that Walker was the better player in '04 and '05. I'm sorry if that doesn't jive with your views, based on watching some games and some highlights, but it's true. First, No I don't troll at all. I have no problem looking at stats, but saying Walker was the better player over Soriano during 2004 & 2005 is something that a stats geek would say. I'm not arrogant enough to say I know more than baseball scouts, coaches, and managers who have spent their lives in baseball. Obviously, Soriano was considered a top player and an All Star while Walker has been offered around the league and rejected in trade proposals. There's a reason Soriano is making $10 million and Walker makes $2.5 million. Not every manager and GM is an idiot (excluding Baker & Hendry). To sum it up, Soriano brings more to a team than Walker and we all know it's not his defense. Do you think that Texas would have traded Soriano for Walker even up at the end of last year?

This is the time you'd hope your manager would help the GM out. After 6 Maddux had given up 4 runs, and should have left with a comfortable lead. But Dusty tried to get 7 out of him, despite being lucky to have only given up 4 at the time. With a 7 man bullpen and these games being meaningless, Maddux should have been pulled, looking decent against a great lineup. There was no reason for him to hit in the 6th either, but Dusty can't think beyond right here and now, and it's questionable how he handles the here and now. Exactly, if Maddux can get through the 5th with a lead, you keep him on a very short leash. First sign of trouble, yank him.

Well said! It is fun discussing some of these rumors, but I've seen pages and pages criticizing the Cubs for thinking about Craig Wilson, Carl Crawford, Abreu, Soriano, etc. for a variety of statistical reasons. Meanwhile, back at the ballpark, the Cubs are on their way to losing 100 games. Hendry is an idiot for wanting Soriano and Kenny Williams is a genius for getting him. You've seen pages and pages of criticizing the Cubs for thinking about Craig Wilson or Abreu? I sure as hell haven't. I'm not even sure there are pages criticizing them for thinking about Soriano. It's not the type of move I'd like to see them make, but I'm not adamently opposed to it either. I've seen Crawford brought up on occasion, usually in the positive. While the Cubs are struggling, Cub fans are going to criticize or attack any move or rumor that involves Hendry. If the Cubs acquired ARod or Miggy, people would complain that they're over the hill, cost too much in salary, and the Cubs gave up too much for them (Pie, Hill, Cedeno, etc.). I've written more than a few times that while the posters are finding fault with every rumored trade, the Cubs are going to lose 100 games this season. I like Walker, but for goodness sake, there's a thread going on now comparing Walker (favorably) to Soriano (and that's without the salary). Sometimes stat geeks need to take their noses out of a book and watch some baseball.

Well said! It is fun discussing some of these rumors, but I've seen pages and pages criticizing the Cubs for thinking about Craig Wilson, Carl Crawford, Abreu, Soriano, etc. for a variety of statistical reasons. Meanwhile, back at the ballpark, the Cubs are on their way to losing 100 games. Hendry is an idiot for wanting Soriano and Kenny Williams is a genius for getting him.

Put down the bottle, it's much too early to start drinking.

Don't trade ARam. It isn't easy replacing a guy who averages 30 HR, 100 RBI, and does a decent job on defense. He's struggled this year, but everyone on the Cubs has struggled (except Barrett & Eyre) this year. The Cubs have lots of holes to fill, but 3B isn't one of them.

"Attitude, hustle." Sounds like he's right up Hendry's alley. His bloody nose early this year will probably make him about an additional $10Million over his career and a rep as a valuable "charachter guy" that someone will undoubtedly overvalue. He's an average player, at best. There are probably 10-15 guys in AAA that can match his overall production. On a side note, with the Sox struggling, I can't wait until we start hearing people bemoan the Rowand trade because it stole away the Sox's "Heart and Soul" or whatever inane garbage. Thome has single handedly won about 20 games for the Sox this year with his power and presence in the lineup. It was a masterstroke by Williams, and if they hadn't made that trade, with the pitching they've gotten this year, they's be out of the race. I think that is quite an exaggeration since many AAA players never make it to the majors, let alone become starters in CF for a World Series winner. I agree that Thome has saved the White Sox this year, but they expected some production out of CF and haven't gotten any. Thome has been an outstanding addition to the Sox, but they have missed the production and "Heart and Soul" that Rowand has provided. The Sox were even rumored as possible trade partners to get Rowand back. You don't think there are 10-15 guys in AAA who could hit .275 with 13-15 HR and play good defense in CF? We'll have to agree to disagree on that. Also, as for the last paragraph, take Thome off this team, and put Rowand back, and the Sox are at .500 right now, even with all the red-ass-ness, want to, character, whatever. If there were, they would be starters in the majors and not playing at AAA. As for the comment on Thome, I agreed that Thome has saved the Sox this year, but Rowand did add something to the Sox that they lack this year. It's not an either/or discussion. If the Sox could get Rowand back, they would run away with the division this year.

You don't have to wait until the end of the game to log onto NSBB.

"Attitude, hustle." Sounds like he's right up Hendry's alley. His bloody nose early this year will probably make him about an additional $10Million over his career and a rep as a valuable "charachter guy" that someone will undoubtedly overvalue. He's an average player, at best. There are probably 10-15 guys in AAA that can match his overall production. On a side note, with the Sox struggling, I can't wait until we start hearing people bemoan the Rowand trade because it stole away the Sox's "Heart and Soul" or whatever inane garbage. Thome has single handedly won about 20 games for the Sox this year with his power and presence in the lineup. It was a masterstroke by Williams, and if they hadn't made that trade, with the pitching they've gotten this year, they's be out of the race. I think that is quite an exaggeration since many AAA players never make it to the majors, let alone become starters in CF for a World Series winner. I agree that Thome has saved the White Sox this year, but they expected some production out of CF and haven't gotten any. Thome has been an outstanding addition to the Sox, but they have missed the production and "Heart and Soul" that Rowand has provided. The Sox were even rumored as possible trade partners to get Rowand back.

They have a young CF (Shane Vitterino) who they seem to like better for the future and Rowand can bring in some prospects.

If the Cubs trade Pierre and/or Jones, the Phillies are rumored to be shopping Aaron Rowand. He is not the big name player most of us are looking for, but he seems to add a spark to the lineup. I must admit that I dislike most things involving the White Sox, but Rowand did impress me with his attitude and hustle. The White Sox made a good deal in getting Thome for Rowand, but they have suffered in CF since he was traded.

Today's Tribune hints that Hendry might be trying to broker a 3-way deal basically sending Maddux to the Dodgers for Izituris and Izituris plus prospects from the Dodgers and Cubs going to the Orioles for Tejada. Obviously there must be other players (or cash) involved between the Cubs and Dodgers, but it sounds promising if it's true.

Today's Tribune is downplaying a Maddux trade, basically saying that he would have to ask to be traded and that he seem okay with just staying in Chicago the rest of the season. I love Maddux, but I was hoping to get something of value for him next week.

According to Ben Maller, ARod said he would veto the blockbuster trade with the Phillies that would send ARod and Melky Cabrera to the Phils for Abreu, Burrell, Gordon, and David Bell. I'm sure the trade was pure fantasy, but that would really fit the word "blockbuster".