K-Town

yeah, and the Cards jumped to #3. Folks in the Lou are gonna start getting upset if the payroll stays below 90. I can understand the Cubs and BoSox having high ticket prices because of the size of Wrigley and Fenway. St. Louis #3 on that list is a joke. St. Louis has a new ball park to pay for, and doesn't have the market revenue that the Cubs and Bosox have.

If Bernie says it's not happening, then you can pretty much bank on it happening.

interesting stuff Especially considering the amount of fan bickering about batting order. Sammy in '04 comes to mind. I am surprised that something that is so accepted as important and made a big deal about can actually mean so little. Yeah, I am, too. I wonder how many baseball people (coaches, managers, GMs) know about this. And I wonder if there's a large contingent who reject it, despite the evidence. It's not a matter of rejecting the evidence. I doubt if most managers spend hours working on their lineup, but you don't honestly expect managers to pick names out of a hat to put their lineup together, do you?

Larussa didn't print it in the papers. He was asked a question, and he answered. I agree that it should be a non-story.

You think, UK? I'm still uncertain. You don't buy the theory that Reyes is working on a new pitch?

No disagreements there. I think you make a good point...... the Cards haven't had alot of young players who have been worth a hoot to begin with. That's not Larussa's fault. the bolded part above is the exact point I made, but I added Polanco might have been blocked. so you agree with the statement generally, but only if the statement is unqualified and the one possible exception is left out of the equation, thus leaving LaRussa completely untainted. What made Polanco a good prospect?? He only had an OPS above .700 one time in his minor league career, and he got his shot with the big club right after that. I don't care if you're Tony Larussa or Bobby Cox or Dusty Baker......... if a guy can't do better than a .700 OPS in the minor leagues, you don't give him full playing time at the big level.

No disagreements there. I think you make a good point...... the Cards haven't had alot of young players who have been worth a hoot to begin with. That's not Larussa's fault.

I couldn't care less if you put Lee in left field. If you want him getting hurt, I guess that's YOUR issue. I certainly don't want MY guy getting hurt, though. Injuries would be my concern. There's a reason why Pujols isn't in the outfield anymore, and it's not because he was a terrible left-fielder. What's this "my guy" stuff? If you're assemblying an "All NL Central Team" then you are the GM or manager and all the guys are YOUR responsibility. Therefore, the onus is on you to put together the best squad which is why Derrek Lee at first base and Pujols in LF makes the most sense offensively and defensively. I'm not assembling it. I'm telling you why I'd tar & feather "the GM" or "the manager" if he put Pujols in left field. From a standpoint of assembling the best team, it wouldn't be hard to find a left fielder who can put up numbers similar to Derrek Lee's norm, but you're not going to find a first baseman who gives you what Pujols normally does. In other words, you could put Bay, Dunn, and Edmonds in the outfield, and Pujols at first base. Nobody would be out of position, and it would be just as productive as a team with Lee at first and Pujols in the outfield.

I don't think K-Town needs any explanation on how to do any of that. Tell me why I'm wrong here, instead of just taking cheap shots that any third-grader would be proud of.

And Chris Duncan probably looks like a better option than the other left-fielders THIS spring, but he only knows how to play first base. So why do you think that Pujols isn't being moved to the outfield NOW, so Duncan can play first base? Do you have a theory for that? My post had nothing to do with now, it had to do with you falsely stating that Pujols was moved to stop him from being injured. I don't buy your theory (that Pujols was moved because there were no other options at first base, and plenty of outfield options). That's my point. If your theory were true, then why wouldn't they be doing the same thing this year?

I'm not complaining about anything. I'm all for LaRussa using inferior ballplayers and thinking those inferior ballplayers give him a better chance to win in both the short and long term. you sure give an aweful lot of weight to Paquette's 157 ABs in 1999. in 2000, Polanco got 323 ABs, Paquette got more than that. why not give Polanco 500 and Paquette another 150? but you are right, LaRussa did give Polanco a shot in 2001...at the expense of giving Pujols a regular position. yes, McEwing was marginally better than Polanco in 1999. marginally. but again you're missing the whole point, ie. the best thing for an organization isn't necessarily going with the marginally better older player when you can go with a younger guy who may develop into something solid, as Polanco did after moving to Philly and becoming the starting thirdbaseman. my first comment in this thread was a defense of LaRussa, with a caveat about his handling of one player. I don't know if you refuse to recognize that defense or that you won't even concede the potential mishandling of a single player in the past decade by the Cardinals, but I do know your homerism on this board is very tired. Hindsight is brilliant. Polanco's best OPS in the minors was .709, in 1998. Prior to that he hadn't broken .700 at ANY level. It's not like he was busting the door down, demanding a shot. Considering his poor minor league performance, he was fortunate to get a shot AT ALL in 1998, but he did, and he didn't do very well with it (.634 OPS). Back at Memphis in '99, he put up a .621 OPS. So what did he do to deserve alot of at-bats in '99?? And why should Larussa have thought that he'd be worthy of more than a utility role in 2000? As it turned out, he DID perform well in 2000, and was rewarded with 564 at-bats in 2001. How is that mis-handling him? I don't get it.

Hardly. Or is that your theory for anybody who doesn't agree with you?

Polanco went .316 .347 .418 in '00. Paquette never had a season that good in his entire career. He was certainly not as good at the time. Polanco had an OPS+ of 93 in 2000. Paquette was at 104 in '99, so he had earned the opportunity in 2000.

And Chris Duncan probably looks like a better option than the other left-fielders THIS spring, but he only knows how to play first base. So why do you think that Pujols isn't being moved to the outfield NOW, so Duncan can play first base? Do you have a theory for that?

I couldn't care less if you put Lee in left field. If you want him getting hurt, I guess that's YOUR issue. I certainly don't want MY guy getting hurt, though. Injuries would be my concern. There's a reason why Pujols isn't in the outfield anymore, and it's not because he was a terrible left-fielder.

Polanco played quite a bit at the end of his time with the Cards and then was traded for Rolen. he should have had not-so-super Joe's PT in 1999 and Paquette's PT in 2000. Polanco was terrible in '99. Paquette was coming off of a pretty good year ('99), in 2000, and Polanco hadn't proven a thing yet. It's not surprising that Paquette got the majority of the playing time. can you put your homeristic defense of everything Cardinal aside for one post and keep your comments confined to the context of the conversation. the conversation is about managers not allowing young players to develop in favor of giving older, crappy players playing time and roster spots. if Polanco was terrible in 1999, what was McEwing? Polanco caught and surpassed McEwing as a prosepect in 1997 when both played in AA. Polanco as a 21 year old and McEwing as a 24 year old. McEwing was always terrible and really stood no chance of ever being anything but terrible, and proved so by spending three years at the same level in the minors. so what would LaRussa have lost by giving the younger, better Polanco that PT instead of McEwing? Paquette was ok in 99 with a very small sample size, and I think spent most of 98 in the minors. he certainly wasn't worthy of getting 385 ABs in 2000 when he absolutely sucked since LaRussa had Polanco, who was far better than Paquette in 2000, at his disposal. Polanco got 323 at-bats in 2000, at age 24, so he wasn't exactly being "ignored" by Larussa. Paquette was just as good at the time. McEwing was better than Polanco in '99. Larussa was TRYING to field the team that he thought would help him win more games. At the same time, Polanco developed into a very good player under Larussa, so I'm not sure what your complaint is.

None. But it's about as realistic as Pujols EVER stepping foot in the outfield again. Funny, because zero is probably a BETTER chance than DLee has of ever playing a position outside of first base. At least Pujols has done it before. You're right...... there's ZERO chance the D. Lee ever plays a position other than first. Likewise, there's ZERO chance that Pujols ever would. Therefore, Lee doesn't crack the starting lineup. If you're picking an all-star team for last year, then you've got a toss-up between Lee and Pujols for first base. If you're picking an all-division team based on the best players in the division, then Pujols is at first base, and Lee gets left out (unfortunately), because Pujols isn't an outfielder.

I believe that would be the same as me. Yeah, but you can't hit.

None. But it's about as realistic as Pujols EVER stepping foot in the outfield again.

If said manager had Derrek Lee on the team with him it's quite likely he would. The Cardinal organization would go ballistic if ANYBODY stuck Albert in the outfield. You guys can have your imaginary fun, but in reality, it would NEVER happen. Pujols would start at first base, and Derrek Lee would be a pinch-hitter extraordinaire. The Ranger organization would go ballistic if ANYBODY stuck Alex Rodriguez at third base. You can have your imaginary fun, but in reality it would NEVER happen. Jeter would start at SS, and Alex Rodriguez would be a pinch hitter extraordinaire. Moving an athletic shortstop to third base is alot different than moving a big strong body to the outfield, where there's a higher risk of injury. If you want Pujols and Derrek Lee both on the team, then take Aramis off, and put Pujols at third base. Aramis is leaving the all NL team either. I'd still put AP in LF and DLee at 1B. Because you're a Cub fan, and there's no accountability for you. Nobody else would even dream of it, at this point in Pujols' career. It's easy for you to call me a homer but I think it makes the most sense. I don't see anyone complaining about ManRam roaming around LF. Pujols would be fine out there; I consider him a better athlete than Manny. Derrek Lee helps the team more by anchoring the infield at 1B. That's clear thinking not biased. Cool. Then let's put Rolen at 2nd base. I'm sure he could handle it.

Isn't EVERY discussion on this board pointless, in the grand scheme of things? Think about it. It's fun to discuss these sorts of things, and not much fun when we all agree.

Polanco played quite a bit at the end of his time with the Cards and then was traded for Rolen. he should have had not-so-super Joe's PT in 1999 and Paquette's PT in 2000. Polanco was terrible in '99. Paquette was coming off of a pretty good year ('99), in 2000, and Polanco hadn't proven a thing yet. It's not surprising that Paquette got the majority of the playing time.

If said manager had Derrek Lee on the team with him it's quite likely he would. The Cardinal organization would go ballistic if ANYBODY stuck Albert in the outfield. You guys can have your imaginary fun, but in reality, it would NEVER happen. Pujols would start at first base, and Derrek Lee would be a pinch-hitter extraordinaire. The Ranger organization would go ballistic if ANYBODY stuck Alex Rodriguez at third base. You can have your imaginary fun, but in reality it would NEVER happen. Jeter would start at SS, and Alex Rodriguez would be a pinch hitter extraordinaire. Moving an athletic shortstop to third base is alot different than moving a big strong body to the outfield, where there's a higher risk of injury. If you want Pujols and Derrek Lee both on the team, then take Aramis off, and put Pujols at third base. Aramis is leaving the all NL team either. I'd still put AP in LF and DLee at 1B. Because you're a Cub fan, and there's no accountability for you. Nobody else would even dream of it, at this point in Pujols' career.

Anybody know what Pecota said last year?

If said manager had Derrek Lee on the team with him it's quite likely he would. The Cardinal organization would go ballistic if ANYBODY stuck Albert in the outfield. You guys can have your imaginary fun, but in reality, it would NEVER happen. Pujols would start at first base, and Derrek Lee would be a pinch-hitter extraordinaire. The Ranger organization would go ballistic if ANYBODY stuck Alex Rodriguez at third base. You can have your imaginary fun, but in reality it would NEVER happen. Jeter would start at SS, and Alex Rodriguez would be a pinch hitter extraordinaire. Moving an athletic shortstop to third base is alot different than moving a big strong body to the outfield, where there's a higher risk of injury. If you want Pujols and Derrek Lee both on the team, then take Aramis off, and put Pujols at third base.